Dalziel wrote:Vipers FC are pleased to announce junior trial dates for the 2016 season. Located on extensive grounds at St Clair Oval, Woodville, we provide qualified coaches and a friendly environment with a strong focus on junior development at a reasonable cost.
This will be our 5th year of juniors in which time we have experienced significant growth in numbers. We anticipate this growth continuing now we are able to enter teams into JPL competition - We have been accepted into the FFSA senior men's competition starting in 2016, so can now provide the full pathway.
Dates are:
Born 2005 to and including 2011 - Tuesday 13 October 6:30pm to 8pm and Thursday 15 October 6:30pm to 8pm
Born 1999 to and including 2004 - Wednesday 14 October 6:30pm to 8pm and Friday 16th October 6:30pm to 8pm
A deposit of $250 will be required to be paid within 7 days of trial to secure place
Prices for season:
Includes uniform (2 uniforms for 12's and above and other apparel), FFSA registration and insurance, use of equipment, coaching fees, and 2 tickets to club function.
Under 5 and 6 $250
Under 7 to under 11 $375
Under 12 to under 17 $495
Appears to be great value for the money. Good to see a club keeping junior fees to an affordable level
Steve#4 wrote:Why only one club putting forward their fees to the public?
I think all clubs should be transparent and let parents of prospective juniors know what they are up for
I'm more interested in knowing who the coaches are than the fees
Has its place for sure but plenty of coaches that have done good things but are unknown.
Most parents take pot luck as they are not in the loop, plenty of horror stories in regards to coaches at the so called bigger as well as the smaller clubs.
I coached in Adelaide for 3 years, was on this site reguarly and i still couldn't name 5 of the best junior coaches????
fball12 wrote:Why is nearly every club trialling on September 21? If you don't trial on the first night with most clubs you don't have a chance.
How are kids supposed to get a fair go when most clubs trial on the same night??
Totally agree with you the whole system of junior trials gets worse every year. i think everyone forgets that this is about the kids, and the whole system is totally unfair on them. There are so many clubs all holding trials next week and all saying you have to trial on all days. How is this fair? i have sons who are looking to trial at one club and if they dont get in there wanted to trial somewhere else. However they are not going to be able to do this as both clubs are having trials the same week. Even if they are not on the same days you could find that your child has to trial 5 to 6 days in a row, this is not good when we are talking about kids as young as 8-12. All that is going to happen if kids dont get in at the first club they trial for and then find they are unable to trial elswhere is that they will leave FFSA clubs and go to a different league. Is this really what FFSA want is talented kids leaving just because they could not get in at the first club they had a trial with. It is about time FFSA managed junior trials better with the clubs and sort this out!
fball12 wrote:Why is nearly every club trialling on September 21? If you don't trial on the first night with most clubs you don't have a chance.
How are kids supposed to get a fair go when most clubs trial on the same night??
Totally agree with you the whole system of junior trials gets worse every year. i think everyone forgets that this is about the kids, and the whole system is totally unfair on them. There are so many clubs all holding trials next week and all saying you have to trial on all days. How is this fair? i have sons who are looking to trial at one club and if they dont get in there wanted to trial somewhere else. However they are not going to be able to do this as both clubs are having trials the same week. Even if they are not on the same days you could find that your child has to trial 5 to 6 days in a row, this is not good when we are talking about kids as young as 8-12. All that is going to happen if kids dont get in at the first club they trial for and then find they are unable to trial elswhere is that they will leave FFSA clubs and go to a different league. Is this really what FFSA want is talented kids leaving just because they could not get in at the first club they had a trial with. It is about time FFSA managed junior trials better with the clubs and sort this out!
...I don't think its the FFSA. I think it is a club junior coordinator's decision. As a coach I find it frustrating too because if a child is only able to come along to one session, it's almost impossible to make a justifiable decision on that 1 session. I tried to look at it from a club's perspective - could it be that clubs don't like the way parents/players such as yourself opt to come to trial only if they don't get into their first preference??
fball12 wrote:Why is nearly every club trialling on September 21? If you don't trial on the first night with most clubs you don't have a chance.
How are kids supposed to get a fair go when most clubs trial on the same night??
Totally agree with you the whole system of junior trials gets worse every year. i think everyone forgets that this is about the kids, and the whole system is totally unfair on them. There are so many clubs all holding trials next week and all saying you have to trial on all days. How is this fair? i have sons who are looking to trial at one club and if they dont get in there wanted to trial somewhere else. However they are not going to be able to do this as both clubs are having trials the same week. Even if they are not on the same days you could find that your child has to trial 5 to 6 days in a row, this is not good when we are talking about kids as young as 8-12. All that is going to happen if kids dont get in at the first club they trial for and then find they are unable to trial elswhere is that they will leave FFSA clubs and go to a different league. Is this really what FFSA want is talented kids leaving just because they could not get in at the first club they had a trial with. It is about time FFSA managed junior trials better with the clubs and sort this out!
...I don't think its the FFSA. I think it is a club junior coordinator's decision. As a coach I find it frustrating too because if a child is only able to come along to one session, it's almost impossible to make a justifiable decision on that 1 session. I tried to look at it from a club's perspective - could it be that clubs don't like the way parents/players such as yourself opt to come to trial only if they don't get into their first preference??
I don't think that's fair to criticise the parents. They are only trying to do what is best for their child. Its great if you can trial at only 1 club and know that you are definitely going to get in... not everyone has that luxury! My son is out of the junior system for quite a few years now, so we don't have to deal with this anymore thankfully. However he is so disillusioned by the whole Fed system that he is going to play amateurs this year!
fball12 wrote:Why is nearly every club trialling on September 21? If you don't trial on the first night with most clubs you don't have a chance.
How are kids supposed to get a fair go when most clubs trial on the same night??
Totally agree with you the whole system of junior trials gets worse every year. i think everyone forgets that this is about the kids, and the whole system is totally unfair on them. There are so many clubs all holding trials next week and all saying you have to trial on all days. How is this fair? i have sons who are looking to trial at one club and if they dont get in there wanted to trial somewhere else. However they are not going to be able to do this as both clubs are having trials the same week. Even if they are not on the same days you could find that your child has to trial 5 to 6 days in a row, this is not good when we are talking about kids as young as 8-12. All that is going to happen if kids dont get in at the first club they trial for and then find they are unable to trial elswhere is that they will leave FFSA clubs and go to a different league. Is this really what FFSA want is talented kids leaving just because they could not get in at the first club they had a trial with. It is about time FFSA managed junior trials better with the clubs and sort this out!
...I don't think its the FFSA. I think it is a club junior coordinator's decision. As a coach I find it frustrating too because if a child is only able to come along to one session, it's almost impossible to make a justifiable decision on that 1 session. I tried to look at it from a club's perspective - could it be that clubs don't like the way parents/players such as yourself opt to come to trial only if they don't get into their first preference??
Most kids will trial at their current club first, but if they're not entirely happy there they will want to trial elsewhere.
What if they're not selected at their current club? What else are they supposed to do?
fball12 wrote:Why is nearly every club trialling on September 21? If you don't trial on the first night with most clubs you don't have a chance.
How are kids supposed to get a fair go when most clubs trial on the same night??
Totally agree with you the whole system of junior trials gets worse every year. i think everyone forgets that this is about the kids, and the whole system is totally unfair on them. There are so many clubs all holding trials next week and all saying you have to trial on all days. How is this fair? i have sons who are looking to trial at one club and if they dont get in there wanted to trial somewhere else. However they are not going to be able to do this as both clubs are having trials the same week. Even if they are not on the same days you could find that your child has to trial 5 to 6 days in a row, this is not good when we are talking about kids as young as 8-12. All that is going to happen if kids dont get in at the first club they trial for and then find they are unable to trial elswhere is that they will leave FFSA clubs and go to a different league. Is this really what FFSA want is talented kids leaving just because they could not get in at the first club they had a trial with. It is about time FFSA managed junior trials better with the clubs and sort this out!
...I don't think its the FFSA. I think it is a club junior coordinator's decision. As a coach I find it frustrating too because if a child is only able to come along to one session, it's almost impossible to make a justifiable decision on that 1 session. I tried to look at it from a club's perspective - could it be that clubs don't like the way parents/players such as yourself opt to come to trial only if they don't get into their first preference??
So you think a child should only be able to trial at a club and play for his first choice team? How ridiculous. Parents have lots to consider when finding a club distance from their home, standard of coaching, fees, nights they train. Then if you have more one child what to do if one gets accepted at one club and the other does not. It is hard and a lot of times you can not get in to your first choice, so you have to have a second option. With so many clubs having trials at the same time this is becoming very difficult and they only people it will affect is the kids themselves and these are the ones we need to be developing not making them suffer. I think FFSA should step in and manage with the clubs the trial system so that all the clubs are not having trials at the same time. Remember what junior football is all about! the kids not the clubs!
So you think a child should only be able to trial at a club and play for his first choice team? How ridiculous. Parents have lots to consider when finding a club distance from their home, standard of coaching, fees, nights they train. Then if you have more one child what to do if one gets accepted at one club and the other does not. It is hard and a lot of times you can not get in to your first choice, so you have to have a second option. With so many clubs having trials at the same time this is becoming very difficult and they only people it will affect is the kids themselves and these are the ones we need to be developing not making them suffer. I think FFSA should step in and manage with the clubs the trial system so that all the clubs are not having trials at the same time. Remember what junior football is all about! the kids not the clubs![/quote]
Chill out Papou! (you not me!) Slow down when you read. Try pointing to each word as you go, or try flipping the vowel...try stretching each phoneme?
I didn't even suggest that's what I think. In fact, I actually said I find it frustrating also. Alternatively, I tried to understand it from another perspective...
Papou wrote:So you think a child should only be able to trial at a club and play for his first choice team? How ridiculous. Parents have lots to consider when finding a club distance from their home, standard of coaching, fees, nights they train. Then if you have more one child what to do if one gets accepted at one club and the other does not. It is hard and a lot of times you can not get in to your first choice, so you have to have a second option. With so many clubs having trials at the same time this is becoming very difficult and they only people it will affect is the kids themselves and these are the ones we need to be developing not making them suffer. I think FFSA should step in and manage with the clubs the trial system so that all the clubs are not having trials at the same time. Remember what junior football is all about! the kids not the clubs!
Chill out Papou! (you not me!) Slow down when you read. Try pointing to each word as you go, or try flipping the vowel...try stretching each phoneme?
I didn't even suggest that's what I think. In fact, I actually said I find it frustrating also. Alternatively, I tried to understand it from another perspective...[/quote]
Sorry Papou i am very passionate about my boys and also about football. I believe there are a lot of things wrong with junior football in our state and the trial system here is just one of them. My point is the clubs seem to forget the most important thing is the kids and not the clubs. They need to start putting the kids first especially if they want to grow football in this country and our state.
Its a no brainer for clubs this year due to School holidays. If a club has 12 Junior Teams to fill they need to get it sorted as soon as possible. This year players will have been offered a position and deposits paid before the 29th. There will always be a few positions available at clubs after trials and most coaches will arrange a additional session where required.
Its not just football, I've spent the last couple of months trying to get my 8 year old daughter into a netball club, its just as crazy.
What happened to our day when if a coach wanted a certain player they went and got them, hey we need a full back for what ever reason, then go and get one, but I personally don't understand trialling the whole team that has just spent the last 10 months playing for you, is it not about long term development, building and improving the players, lets be honest, if 1 or 2 of your players makes it into the first team you've done a good job.
paul merson wrote:Its not just football, I've spent the last couple of months trying to get my 8 year old daughter into a netball club, its just as crazy.
What happened to our day when if a coach wanted a certain player they went and got them, hey we need a full back for what ever reason, then go and get one, but I personally don't understand trialling the whole team that has just spent the last 10 months playing for you, is it not about long term development, building and improving the players, lets be honest, if 1 or 2 of your players makes it into the first team you've done a good job.
I don't see many schools poaching kids so that they can brag about the smartest students, why can't clubs take a similar stand and focus on what they have from the introductory ages!
paul merson wrote:Its not just football, I've spent the last couple of months trying to get my 8 year old daughter into a netball club, its just as crazy.
What happened to our day when if a coach wanted a certain player they went and got them, hey we need a full back for what ever reason, then go and get one, but I personally don't understand trialling the whole team that has just spent the last 10 months playing for you, is it not about long term development, building and improving the players, lets be honest, if 1 or 2 of your players makes it into the first team you've done a good job.
I don't see many schools poaching kids so that they can brag about the smartest students, why can't clubs take a similar stand and focus on what they have from the introductory ages!
Because a school doesn't need to have a kid sitting in the back row on the left hand side of the class room, but I get your point and agree.
This is why the FFSA needs to get involved in grassroots, there needs to be at least 2 or 3 youth only leagues separate from seniors and similar in structure to E&D, get every kid possible playing football. When I was a kid we all had our local teams in local leagues, if you were asked or wanted to try out at a higher level more development orientated youth team (JPL ?) you went along and gave it a go. If you were recommended most clubs would have a look at you anytime during the year. If you didn’t make it you continued with your original club, no worries. Benefits two ways, best kids from a much wider pool end up in JPL and saves this unfair scramble for spots a lot of kids have to endure every September knowing if they don’t get in they’ve got nothing.
N5 1BH wrote:This is why the FFSA needs to get involved in grassroots, there needs to be at least 2 or 3 youth only leagues separate from seniors and similar in structure to E&D, get every kid possible playing football. When I was a kid we all had our local teams in local leagues, if you were asked or wanted to try out at a higher level more development orientated youth team (JPL ?) you went along and gave it a go. If you were recommended most clubs would have a look at you anytime during the year. If you didn’t make it you continued with your original club, no worries. Benefits two ways, best kids from a much wider pool end up in JPL and saves this unfair scramble for spots a lot of kids have to endure every September knowing if they don’t get in they’ve got nothing.
This is why the JSL league is under used. Clubs can have multiple teams but only a few actually bother.
N5 1BH wrote:This is why the FFSA needs to get involved in grassroots, there needs to be at least 2 or 3 youth only leagues separate from seniors and similar in structure to E&D, get every kid possible playing football. When I was a kid we all had our local teams in local leagues, if you were asked or wanted to try out at a higher level more development orientated youth team (JPL ?) you went along and gave it a go. If you were recommended most clubs would have a look at you anytime during the year. If you didn’t make it you continued with your original club, no worries. Benefits two ways, best kids from a much wider pool end up in JPL and saves this unfair scramble for spots a lot of kids have to endure every September knowing if they don’t get in they’ve got nothing.
This is why the JSL league is under used. Clubs can have multiple teams but only a few actually bother.
Clubs want JSL teams. But coaches are limited and so are facilities. We have to remember that 95% of people involved with clubs are volunteer. If you stock 1 JPL team from U6 to U17 (12 teams) + 3 senior teams. Thats 15 teams for most clubs and they're reaching their limit. Given most have muliple SSG teams (due to less numbers required to fill a team) most probably sit around the 20 team mark. Add JSL teams to that and you start getting into 25 teams. Thats a hell of alot of organisation, coaches, and resources required for most clubs who have max 1, 2 or 3 pitches.
I think we can only get rid of trials once clubs start offering an acceptable product. I coached my latest team for 3 seasons (u12 to u14) and we probably rolled over no more than 2 players per season in a squad of 16. Most stayed and were happy at Playford. Now ive moved on, all have indicated they're trialling elsewhere. People aren't loyal to clubs, they're loyal to the product a club offers. In my opinion, clubs who are holding open trials in unders 12-17 aren't confident in their development programs. Kids and parents have every right to sit there and go "which coach/club is going to give me the best possible chance to become a senior footballer?". If clubs can offer a product that says "We can" then you will find players become loyal and the need to trial will slowly dissipate.
I believe Raiders have moved to "invite only" now. I hope more clubs will follow suite. PRODUCE and DEVELOP..
N5 1BH wrote:This is why the FFSA needs to get involved in grassroots, there needs to be at least 2 or 3 youth only leagues separate from seniors and similar in structure to E&D, get every kid possible playing football. When I was a kid we all had our local teams in local leagues, if you were asked or wanted to try out at a higher level more development orientated youth team (JPL ?) you went along and gave it a go. If you were recommended most clubs would have a look at you anytime during the year. If you didn’t make it you continued with your original club, no worries. Benefits two ways, best kids from a much wider pool end up in JPL and saves this unfair scramble for spots a lot of kids have to endure every September knowing if they don’t get in they’ve got nothing.
This is why the JSL league is under used. Clubs can have multiple teams but only a few actually bother.
Clubs want JSL teams. But coaches are limited and so are facilities. We have to remember that 95% of people involved with clubs are volunteer. If you stock 1 JPL team from U6 to U17 (12 teams) + 3 senior teams. Thats 15 teams for most clubs and they're reaching their limit. Given most have muliple SSG teams (due to less numbers required to fill a team) most probably sit around the 20 team mark. Add JSL teams to that and you start getting into 25 teams. Thats a hell of alot of organisation, coaches, and resources required for most clubs who have max 1, 2 or 3 pitches.
I think we can only get rid of trials once clubs start offering an acceptable product. I coached my latest team for 3 seasons (u12 to u14) and we probably rolled over no more than 2 players per season in a squad of 16. Most stayed and were happy at Playford. Now ive moved on, all have indicated they're trialling elsewhere. People aren't loyal to clubs, they're loyal to the product a club offers. In my opinion, clubs who are holding open trials in unders 12-17 aren't confident in their development programs. Kids and parents have every right to sit there and go "which coach/club is going to give me the best possible chance to become a senior footballer?". If clubs can offer a product that says "We can" then you will find players become loyal and the need to trial will slowly dissipate.
I believe Raiders have moved to "invite only" now. I hope more clubs will follow suite. PRODUCE and DEVELOP..
Which club offers open trials?
This is just an illusion. They all have protected players and not necessarily the best players.
N5 1BH wrote:This is why the FFSA needs to get involved in grassroots, there needs to be at least 2 or 3 youth only leagues separate from seniors and similar in structure to E&D, get every kid possible playing football. When I was a kid we all had our local teams in local leagues, if you were asked or wanted to try out at a higher level more development orientated youth team (JPL ?) you went along and gave it a go. If you were recommended most clubs would have a look at you anytime during the year. If you didn’t make it you continued with your original club, no worries. Benefits two ways, best kids from a much wider pool end up in JPL and saves this unfair scramble for spots a lot of kids have to endure every September knowing if they don’t get in they’ve got nothing.
This is why the JSL league is under used. Clubs can have multiple teams but only a few actually bother.
Clubs want JSL teams. But coaches are limited and so are facilities. We have to remember that 95% of people involved with clubs are volunteer. If you stock 1 JPL team from U6 to U17 (12 teams) + 3 senior teams. Thats 15 teams for most clubs and they're reaching their limit. Given most have muliple SSG teams (due to less numbers required to fill a team) most probably sit around the 20 team mark. Add JSL teams to that and you start getting into 25 teams. Thats a hell of alot of organisation, coaches, and resources required for most clubs who have max 1, 2 or 3 pitches.
I think we can only get rid of trials once clubs start offering an acceptable product. I coached my latest team for 3 seasons (u12 to u14) and we probably rolled over no more than 2 players per season in a squad of 16. Most stayed and were happy at Playford. Now ive moved on, all have indicated they're trialling elsewhere. People aren't loyal to clubs, they're loyal to the product a club offers. In my opinion, clubs who are holding open trials in unders 12-17 aren't confident in their development programs. Kids and parents have every right to sit there and go "which coach/club is going to give me the best possible chance to become a senior footballer?". If clubs can offer a product that says "We can" then you will find players become loyal and the need to trial will slowly dissipate.
I believe Raiders have moved to "invite only" now. I hope more clubs will follow suite. PRODUCE and DEVELOP..
Raiders is hardly the model club for junior development when they resort to targetting good players from other clubs and then send them an invitation to trial.
An "invitation." Really?
Let's just call it for what it is. Poaching.
For a club with highly credentialed coaches, it's a shame they don't scout the worst performers from each club, and give them a development opportunity instead. Just imagine how much those kids would learn.
But no, at the end of the day it's not really about development. It's only about building winning teams.
themessenger wrote: Raiders is hardly the model club for junior development when they resort to targetting good players from other clubs and then send them an invitation to trial.
An "invitation." Really?
Let's just call it for what it is. Poaching.
For a club with highly credentialed coaches, it's a shame they don't scout the worst performers from each club, and give them a development opportunity instead. Just imagine how much those kids would learn.
But no, at the end of the day it's not really about development. It's only about building winning teams.
So what is it that Barcelona or Ajax do? Do they not "invite" select players to enter their academies? Personally, i dont think its "poaching". I think its offering most kids a better learning environment surrounded by elite players. Put the best kids with the best kids. Club 'state teams'. If other clubs were offering the same product (or better), would kids leave their current environments? no. They aren't bribing with money etc.
I do understand what you mean though, and if it were 6-8 players per squad each season i would be against it. But if its 1-2 players every 1-2 seasons, then i think targeted acquisitions are fine. I had players targeted every season by opposition coaches and never had a player leave that i wanted to keep hold of... build the right environment and you wont have to worry about poaching.
fball12 wrote:Why is nearly every club trialling on September 21? If you don't trial on the first night with most clubs you don't have a chance.
How are kids supposed to get a fair go when most clubs trial on the same night??
There are clubs trialling in October immediately after the school holidays have ended, Playford and Modbury are two, for any player living out north of the city.
fball12 wrote:Why is nearly every club trialling on September 21? If you don't trial on the first night with most clubs you don't have a chance.
How are kids supposed to get a fair go when most clubs trial on the same night??
There are clubs trialling in October immediately after the school holidays have ended, Playford and Modbury are two, for any player living out north of the city.
Good idea by those two clubs if they are looking at increasing the number of teams. Mount Barker and Vipers doing a similar thing to increase numbers.
fball12 wrote:Why is nearly every club trialling on September 21? If you don't trial on the first night with most clubs you don't have a chance.
How are kids supposed to get a fair go when most clubs trial on the same night??
There are clubs trialling in October immediately after the school holidays have ended, Playford and Modbury are two, for any player living out north of the city.
Yes I did know about Modbury.
Well done to those clubs for being reasonable and sensible with trials.
Totally agree with the problems due to trialing in late Sept.
Mount Barker will trial in mid October for its Junior JSL teams on the weekends to give anyone who fancies a go the opportunity....
Its an attempt to be sensible but has its downside too in terms of some kids signing up early elsewhere....
Mount Barker also has a version of the E&D teams in the AHJSA league which lets ANY junior of any ability to play at the club regardless and gets the local kids playing soccer full stop with no trials and no 'invitations'!
Kids should have an option to just play but the bigger clubs have a different agenda and they all suffer from 'keeping up with the Jones' ...... The number of club having trials on the same dates / week in September is mental... Wont change anytime soon unless the FFSA creates a policy (and they haven't a great track record getting something through that the big guns agree on).
themessenger wrote:themessenger wrote: Raiders is hardly the model club for junior development when they resort to targetting good players from other clubs and then send them an invitation to trial. An "invitation." Really?Let's just call it for what it is. Poaching.For a club with highly credentialed coaches, it's a shame they don't scout the worst performers from each club, and give them a development opportunity instead. Just imagine how much those kids would learn.But no, at the end of the day it's not really about development. It's only about building winning teams.
So what is it that Barcelona or Ajax do? Do they not "invite" select players to enter their academies? Personally, i dont think its "poaching". I think its offering most kids a better learning environment surrounded by elite players. Put the best kids with the best kids. Club 'state teams'. If other clubs were offering the same product (or better), would kids leave their current environments? no. They aren't bribing with money etc. I do understand what you mean though, and if it were 6-8 players per squad each season i would be against it. But if its 1-2 players every 1-2 seasons, then i think targeted acquisitions are fine. I had players targeted every season by opposition coaches and never had a player leave that i wanted to keep hold of... build the right environment and you wont have to worry about poaching
Sad Modbury losing good boys down to the Croatian Centre, Messenger you may need to see if the new u18 coach can persuade them to stay
"The trouble with referees , they know the rules , but they don't know the game." Bill Shankly
Dash Riprock wrote:
Mount Barker also has a version of the E&D teams in the AHJSA league which lets ANY junior of any ability to play at the club regardless and gets the local kids playing soccer full stop with no trials and no 'invitations'!
Problem with AHJSA is the games are played on Saturday and that clashes with school football.
Chill out Papou! (you not me!) Slow down when you read. Try pointing to each word as you go, or try flipping the vowel...try stretching each phoneme?
