Good Coaching Bad Coaching

[nearpost]

? How many NPL clubs have C license coaches for their JPL teams and 2 TD's SSG and JPL.

[Mrs Red]

Quick couple of questions

1- Why do clubs send their coaches to the FFSA Coaching Courses?

2- How many clubs have given the FFA National Curriculum a go?

Answers
Q1
1. Because clubs have to - because if coaches are not qualified they are not allowed to stand in the technical area on a Sunday. In every JPL/JSL application all coaches have to be named. If they do not meet the coaching criteria, clubs a sent a reminder email that "Joe Bloggs" needs to complete appropriate course asap otherwise they are not allowed to coach. However when an NPL club can get away with having a senior coach unqualified - this makes a mockery of the whole thing! FFSA have rules in place and often allow too many to break them.

2. Because clubs hope that once completed the coach will become a better coach and asset to your club.

Q2
We have but we know we lack the volunteers to ensure it occurs right throughout our club. We also can't afford to pay anyone (eg a T&D) to do that for us. We can only encourage coaches to peruse the documents, take the information on board and use it as a tool for their coaching. Few would do this - sadly.

In conclusion in terms of the coaching courses a measurement of the outcomes needs to be done. Has the course reached the objectives that the course set out to achieve? I am not sure they are?

Lets ask why coaches do coaching courses and you might just get the same answers with the majority answering point no. 1 - because they have to!

[matty2323]

Matt,

Clubs would love to operate two different departments as you say - Football and then Administration. Unfortunately due to lack of volunteers the Football orientated people have to do some administration or their club will not survive, so in a sense something has to give - often offering that extra time to ensuring good football programs are in place sadly suffers. But hey if we don't achieve a certain level of accreditation that FFSA requires (administration) then we are told that our club could find itself not in the highest competition. It's a balancing act.

Raiders have the most personnel in their club with links to or who are currently working for FFSA. No other club has the luxury of having so many FFSA coaches on their doorstep to guide and help their club's coaches and football department.

I've been at my current club since the inception of the curriculum (2009), and early on we had FFSA personnel come out to the club. I still remember the evening when Carl Veart came out with his squad and put on a structure sessions to allow coaches to see how its done. All coaches were required to attend, and coaches from other northern clubs invited out too.. Within 40 minutes of the session, out of around 30-40 coaches, there was 3 left still watching.

Raiders have those links because they just on board with the curriculum. They took responsibility and implemented. If im the FFSA (with limited funding) im going to invest my time and effort into clubs who actually show they want to improve. Even when i had conversations with Gombau he talked about taking an interest in Raiders because they seemed to be heading in the right direction.

The football programs dont have to be fancy, they can be as basic and enforcing the implementation of the curriculum from the top administrators down. Like a few people have said on here, myself included, we promote the use of it within our clubs, encourage coaches to read it, but in the end, we cant enforce it. Well that has to change. Clubs need to find one person willing to get it going and the club then needs to back them. If coaches who have been at the club for 10 years aren't willing to adapt, remove them. Out with the old, in with the new.

[johnydep]

Matt,

Clubs would love to operate two different departments as you say - Football and then Administration. Unfortunately due to lack of volunteers the Football orientated people have to do some administration or their club will not survive, so in a sense something has to give - often offering that extra time to ensuring good football programs are in place sadly suffers. But hey if we don't achieve a certain level of accreditation that FFSA requires (administration) then we are told that our club could find itself not in the highest competition. It's a balancing act.

Raiders have the most personnel in their club with links to or who are currently working for FFSA. No other club has the luxury of having so many FFSA coaches on their doorstep to guide and help their club's coaches and football department.

I've been at my current club since the inception of the curriculum (2009), and early on we had FFSA personnel come out to the club. I still remember the evening when Carl Veart came out with his squad and put on a structure sessions to allow coaches to see how its done. All coaches were required to attend, and coaches from other northern clubs invited out too.. Within 40 minutes of the session, out of around 30-40 coaches, there was 3 left still watching.

Raiders have those links because they just on board with the curriculum. They took responsibility and implemented. If im the FFSA (with limited funding) im going to invest my time and effort into clubs who actually show they want to improve. Even when i had conversations with Gombau he talked about taking an interest in Raiders because they seemed to be heading in the right direction.

The football programs dont have to be fancy, they can be as basic and enforcing the implementation of the curriculum from the top administrators down. Like a few people have said on here, myself included, we promote the use of it within our clubs, encourage coaches to read it, but in the end, we cant enforce it. Well that has to change. Clubs need to find one person willing to get it going and the club then needs to back them. If coaches who have been at the club for 10 years aren't willing to adapt, remove them. Out with the old, in with the new.

Before continuing with your ill-informed comments, I suggest you go out and talk to every clubs football director and watch their junior training sessions. Maybe even take note of any past and present talented players coming from a clubs junior system. Then come back on here and tell us how good or bad each club is.

[matty2323]

Matt,

Clubs would love to operate two different departments as you say - Football and then Administration. Unfortunately due to lack of volunteers the Football orientated people have to do some administration or their club will not survive, so in a sense something has to give - often offering that extra time to ensuring good football programs are in place sadly suffers. But hey if we don't achieve a certain level of accreditation that FFSA requires (administration) then we are told that our club could find itself not in the highest competition. It's a balancing act.

Raiders have the most personnel in their club with links to or who are currently working for FFSA. No other club has the luxury of having so many FFSA coaches on their doorstep to guide and help their club's coaches and football department.

I've been at my current club since the inception of the curriculum (2009), and early on we had FFSA personnel come out to the club. I still remember the evening when Carl Veart came out with his squad and put on a structure sessions to allow coaches to see how its done. All coaches were required to attend, and coaches from other northern clubs invited out too.. Within 40 minutes of the session, out of around 30-40 coaches, there was 3 left still watching.

Raiders have those links because they just on board with the curriculum. They took responsibility and implemented. If im the FFSA (with limited funding) im going to invest my time and effort into clubs who actually show they want to improve. Even when i had conversations with Gombau he talked about taking an interest in Raiders because they seemed to be heading in the right direction.

The football programs dont have to be fancy, they can be as basic and enforcing the implementation of the curriculum from the top administrators down. Like a few people have said on here, myself included, we promote the use of it within our clubs, encourage coaches to read it, but in the end, we cant enforce it. Well that has to change. Clubs need to find one person willing to get it going and the club then needs to back them. If coaches who have been at the club for 10 years aren't willing to adapt, remove them. Out with the old, in with the new.

Before continuing with your ill-informed comments, I suggest you go out and talk to every clubs football director and watch their junior training sessions. Maybe even take note of any past and present talented players coming from a clubs junior system. Then come back on here and tell us how good or bad each club is.

I haven't named one single club as a "bad club". I've just stated 4-5 clubs who i think are leading by example. Every club gives kids the opportunity to play football, so in that sense, i will never call any club "bad". But i do believe some development programs are much superior to others.

[ikon]

Its about being stable and having committed people for 5-6 years ,then you will produce players.

pretty simple really.....


how did the quote below end up on my post?I never wrote Very true?


Very true.

[johnydep]

I haven't named one single club as a "bad club". I've just stated 4-5 clubs who i think are leading by example. Every club gives kids the opportunity to play football, so in that sense, i will never call any club "bad". But i do believe some development programs are much superior to others.

Many clubs have had some sort of football development program in place for many years. A lot using the recommendations from the FFSA and FFA. The key to development is a stable structure, sadly I have seen the FFA and FFSA change the structure and recommendations too many times over the past 10 or so years. Hopefully we have turned the corner and the present structure will remain in place for many years, with only minor changes and lots of assistance.

Have a look at what CKFC had in place in 2009 http://www.mediafire.com/view/ymymxtmhm ... 282%29.pdf

Lets look at the positives of each club and build on them. We all need to see the glass as half full.

[kingkenny]

Is it possible to coach kids if you have never played and how beneficial is it to have coaches that have played at a decent level

[Papou]

Is it possible to coach kids if you have never played and how beneficial is it to have coaches that have played at a decent level

If you have good communication skills and are willing to learn, of course you can. However, i believe that if you have played at a decent level you have more insight into some things, whether you are able to communicate those things is another story.

[God is an Englishman]

Is it possible to coach kids if you have never played and how beneficial is it to have coaches that have played at a decent level

Anyone can coach from a textbook. a good coach understands the game and to do that you have to have played the game.

[God is an Englishman]

Is it possible to coach kids if you have never played and how beneficial is it to have coaches that have played at a decent level

If you have good communication skills and are willing to learn, of course you can. However, i believe that if you have played at a decent level you have more insight into some things, whether you are able to communicate those things is another story.

Like Wenger and Mourinho?

[Papou]

Is it possible to coach kids if you have never played and how beneficial is it to have coaches that have played at a decent level

If you have good communication skills and are willing to learn, of course you can. However, i believe that if you have played at a decent level you have more insight into some things, whether you are able to communicate those things is another story.

Like Wenger and Mourinho?

I like Mourinho, Wenger less so...

[Harry Cahill]

just my 3 cents worth:

Its important that the coach understands the game but How many of the past great players have made great coaches/managers and how many of the best managers were average players?

Reading the comments about how kids should be just thrown the ball and allowed to do as they please until 11s or 12s it seems thats just asking for more trouble as they would have longer to develop bad habits and poor behaviours. Being involved at a senior level and seeing how poor some of the technical skills are and how hard it is to teach them the correct way is extremely difficult and frustrating. Have also noticed in my kids games the kids that have been showed the correct ways to play earlier than the ones that have either started later or just not been instructed properly and has been same issues and frustrations as they lack the technical and team play that others have.

People say that football should be played the "correct way", but what is correct for team A may not be correct for team B or even for the same team against different opposition. A good team will be able to change and modify the way they play to suit the conditions of the game. My kids have always been coached to play the ball but kids being kids sometimes the ball is just kicked long or kids will dribble and run until they either lose it or run into the fence.
Also seen here about kids being played up front in "offside" positions this has been a frustration when watching as it teaches the kids nothing in the game that they can use when they get into the older age groups but has also been interesting to watch how teams combat and counteract this practice.

its always been fun looking in here and reading others opinions and will be interesting to see how others feel.

thanks

[coutinho10]

If a coach is well planned ahead and delivers their sessions as programmed the kids will soak it up like sponges. The kids will pass when they feel they should pass they will go 1v1 when they want and sometimes make plenty of mistakes also which you want as they will never truely learn without mistakes.
Keep to the four core principals in the sponge years and concentrate on the one principle per session and rotate them with plenty of repetition over the year.
1- first touch
2- striking the ball
3- 1v1
4- running with the ball
I have seen my kids through from u7's to u11's and the ones who have been consistent at training over the 5 years with this programme have made sap teams, focus teams and moved up age levels as they have had structured training sessions, not over complicated, always fun and positive. Give them this and they will thrive.
I have seen age groups older and younger not progress as their sessions are all over the place and it shows game day.
Rotating your kids around the field is a must you cannot pigeon hole a kid as a striker because he/her is tall, fast and can strike the ball for an easy goal at u9's and 10's. It is about development not winning. Come u13/14/15's when the other kids catch up but have learnt to play other positions more, will probably get more chance at making trials by other coaches as they have adapted more to the game as they had to battle due to size and know how to play other positions and has more options for selection. The kid that has only ever played as striker is then cut due to a stronger striker that comes along at trials. Keepers also have to play on the field to learn to play with his/her feet.
If your dominating a team and player has scored three put him/her defence put the defender up top put a midfielder in goals , put the goalie in the midfield so they learn to use their feet through traffic. Coaches drop the ego it's not about us it's about the kids developement. End of the day no one is going to come back one day and say remember that team you coached at under 9's undefeated for the year. No one has and no one ever will. If so your coaching for the wrong reasons.

LET THE KIDS HAVE FUN...LET THEM MAKE MISTAKES...THE GAME IS THEIR FOR THE KIDS NOT THE PARENTS..

And parents when you get in the car after the game never tell what they did wrong or they should have done this or done that because it was their decision of learning not yours..all you need to say is did you enjoy yourself today and 99.99% of the time they say yeas even if they kicked it once and it progressed to nothing..

[Papou]

Just an observation: Some of the best coaches I have had and know are teachers with a football background. Something common among them all is they never told me to go about one way of doing something. They challenged me by asking questions and forced me to think.

[matty2323]

Just an observation: Some of the best coaches I have had and know are teachers with a football background. Something common among them all is they never told me to go about one way of doing something. They challenged me by asking questions and forced me to think.

this is what most coaches fail to see. Telling kids to Pass, rather than asking them what else they could have done in certain situations.

"Ok so you had 3 players around you and tried to dribble. What else could you have done? If you have 3 opposition players near you, what does that mean for your team mates?"...

Yes younger kids need to be given direction and instruction, but they seriously dont understand "Team" yet. Let them run, ask them questions, make them think. You will find you will create footballers who think and have good decision making when they're faced with football problems on the field.

As kids get older they will understand team play more and recognise when to dribble and when to pass... but having the ability to do both is what makes a good player. The younger the kids are, the more mistakes they make, and the more they learn. Let them absorb the core skills at that age and then team the team play scenarios as they reach 11v11. If people actually read the curriculum, it clearly outlines it all in there