Do we need a new comp?

[The moyesiah]

I posted this on another thread and figured it needed it's own title.

Right now we have the JPL & JSL, why not change this to the JDL & JPL, what is a JDL you ask? Junior Development League, solely for the development of future senior players. In this comp we only have;

U14 containing the best 13&14 yr olds
U16 containing the best 15&16 yr olds

This comp does not have points or leagues and is structured to be played on a Saturday (following their seniors) as curtain raisers to the Saturday events, getting these kids use to the feel of our competition.

These players are not allowed to drop back into the new JPL structure and are registered under a different umbrella and are simply not eligible for the JPL comp. The new JPL structure is for all other players to play for points and leagues and will be listed as Division 1-100. However each JPL team can list say 4 players within the JPL as rookies as such (so U13/14 JPL players would have 4 rookies) if there is a long term injury to a JDL player, clubs can lift these players into that squad, however only if the replaced player is out for longer than 4 or 6 weeks.

This will end the bs of development, because we will have a development team at every club, and the club can hire a specialised coach. The next rule is quite simple, any player registered within the JPL can not go down and only up, so an U13 registered as an U14 can not drop back into the U13 and can only go up again, easily fixing the stacking teams issue.

Now let the abuse and laughter begin

[mike17]

some good points made

making it compulsory for PL teams to have a team for every age group is counter-productive and causes so many issues

thats my main issue

there are many though

[The moyesiah]

some good points made

making it compulsory for PL teams to have a team for every age group is counter-productive and causes so many issues

thats my main issue

there are many though

these development teams would be the only compulsory teams a club need.

[mike17]

some good points made

making it compulsory for PL teams to have a team for every age group is counter-productive and causes so many issues

thats my main issue

there are many though

these development teams would be the only compulsory teams a club need.

yeh its a good way to go

its crazy that ffsa are not aware how much this issue affects development. especially given that most "technical directors" and the like are not exactly talented when it comes to managing player movement/development and talent identification

shooting ourselves in the foot

[Željko Jurin]

So each club has 2 x 'Academy' teams, one in each of these age groups .... Plus then all normal Sunday age groups and leagues

Has merit

Kick off times is currently 11am/1pm/3pm .... so really can only squeeze in a 9am game, as most clubs don't have proper lights for 5pm ko
Or, if clubs have 2 pitches, can play another match at 11am, same time as u18s

[The moyesiah]

So each club has 2 x 'Academy' teams, one in each of these age groups .... Plus then all normal Sunday age groups and leagues

Has merit

Kick off times is currently 11am/1pm/3pm .... so really can only squeeze in a 9am game, as most clubs don't have proper lights for 5pm ko
Or, if clubs have 2 pitches, can play another match at 11am, same time as u18s

It can easily work, kick offs 845am & 5pm. Surely most, if not all premier league clubs have approved lights. It would be a cool down game after the seniors, with some of the crowd possibly hanging around, it would all be done and dusted and players home by 7pm.

This way clubs can focus on the players they see as their future and give the feeling they really do have a chance to progress, while also offering a team if you are not at that level, which will keep kids wanting to improve and aim for the development squads.

[give us a break]

So each club has 2 x 'Academy' teams, one in each of these age groups .... Plus then all normal Sunday age groups and leagues

Has merit

Kick off times is currently 11am/1pm/3pm .... so really can only squeeze in a 9am game, as most clubs don't have proper lights for 5pm ko
Or, if clubs have 2 pitches, can play another match at 11am, same time as u18s

It can easily work, kick offs 845am & 5pm. Surely most, if not all premier league clubs have approved lights. It would be a cool down game after the seniors, with some of the crowd possibly hanging around, it would all be done and dusted and players home by 7pm.

This way clubs can focus on the players they see as their future and give the feeling they really do have a chance to progress, while also offering a team if you are not at that level, which will keep kids wanting to improve and aim for the development squads.

And the pitches would be in a great shape after 5 matches on a rainy day.

[ikon]

So each club has 2 x 'Academy' teams, one in each of these age groups .... Plus then all normal Sunday age groups and leagues

Has merit

Kick off times is currently 11am/1pm/3pm .... so really can only squeeze in a 9am game, as most clubs don't have proper lights for 5pm ko
Or, if clubs have 2 pitches, can play another match at 11am, same time as u18s

It can easily work, kick offs 845am & 5pm. Surely most, if not all premier league clubs have approved lights. It would be a cool down game after the seniors, with some of the crowd possibly hanging around, it would all be done and dusted and players home by 7pm.

This way clubs can focus on the players they see as their future and give the feeling they really do have a chance to progress, while also offering a team if you are not at that level, which will keep kids wanting to improve and aim for the development squads.

And the pitches would be in a great shape after 5 matches on a rainy day.

add school soccer to that on saturdays....which as a coach is a pain the butt but i feel it offers a different dynamic for kids( Mates, no pressure, school community ..ect)

I like the idea of clubs having academys....not academys at clubs...

[Rehagel's Assistant]

I posted this on another thread and figured it needed it's own title.

Right now we have the JPL & JSL, why not change this to the JDL & JPL, what is a JDL you ask? Junior Development League, solely for the development of future senior players. In this comp we only have;

U14 containing the best 13&14 yr olds
U16 containing the best 15&16 yr olds

This comp does not have points or leagues and is structured to be played on a Saturday (following their seniors) as curtain raisers to the Saturday events, getting these kids use to the feel of our competition.

These players are not allowed to drop back into the new JPL structure and are registered under a different umbrella and are simply not eligible for the JPL comp. The new JPL structure is for all other players to play for points and leagues and will be listed as Division 1-100. However each JPL team can list say 4 players within the JPL as rookies as such (so U13/14 JPL players would have 4 rookies) if there is a long term injury to a JDL player, clubs can lift these players into that squad, however only if the replaced player is out for longer than 4 or 6 weeks.

This will end the bs of development, because we will have a development team at every club, and the club can hire a specialised coach. The next rule is quite simple, any player registered within the JPL can not go down and only up, so an U13 registered as an U14 can not drop back into the U13 and can only go up again, easily fixing the stacking teams issue.

Now let the abuse and laughter begin

hey Moses - seems like you have a lot of time on your hands. First of all whats broke? what are you trying to address?

I assume you have heard of the skillaroo squads who play in comp for no points for those age groups. They already takecare of those kids and also include development train on squads aligned to the skillaroos but still remain and play with their clubs.

[Rehagel's Assistant]

I like the idea of clubs having academys....not academys at clubs...[/quote]

absolutely correct Mr Ikon.........Cumberland Academy versus Academy at Metro.
I know which one I would choose!

[ikon]

can someone fill me in here..about the structure...been asking around and cant seem to work it out and have parents telling me my son is training with ..such and such this week..

Are the u/14 skillaroos mainly 12-13 yr old playing in the u/14a comp.?- they have a squad of players not affliated to clubs and also have train on squads?..how many in the train on squads and when do they train?

and u/16's are mainly 14-15 yr olds playing in u/16a comp- do they also have a squad of players not affliated to clubs and also have a train on squad?- how many in the train on squads an when do they train?

the SA NTC playing in the u/18's is what? 16/17 yr olds?..where do they go after

whats STIC- is this the u/12's that just train in squads?

bit confused sorry .

[on-side]

Can't comment on the others but the NTC squad is playing in Premier League U18s comp and the players are 14-15 years old.

The previous SASI squad that used to play in the Premier League Reserves comp were around 16 - 17 years old (I think).

[The moyesiah]

I posted this on another thread and figured it needed it's own title.

Right now we have the JPL & JSL, why not change this to the JDL & JPL, what is a JDL you ask? Junior Development League, solely for the development of future senior players. In this comp we only have;

U14 containing the best 13&14 yr olds
U16 containing the best 15&16 yr olds

This comp does not have points or leagues and is structured to be played on a Saturday (following their seniors) as curtain raisers to the Saturday events, getting these kids use to the feel of our competition.

These players are not allowed to drop back into the new JPL structure and are registered under a different umbrella and are simply not eligible for the JPL comp. The new JPL structure is for all other players to play for points and leagues and will be listed as Division 1-100. However each JPL team can list say 4 players within the JPL as rookies as such (so U13/14 JPL players would have 4 rookies) if there is a long term injury to a JDL player, clubs can lift these players into that squad, however only if the replaced player is out for longer than 4 or 6 weeks.

This will end the bs of development, because we will have a development team at every club, and the club can hire a specialised coach. The next rule is quite simple, any player registered within the JPL can not go down and only up, so an U13 registered as an U14 can not drop back into the U13 and can only go up again, easily fixing the stacking teams issue.

Now let the abuse and laughter begin

hey Moses - seems like you have a lot of time on your hands. First of all whats broke? what are you trying to address?

I assume you have heard of the skillaroo squads who play in comp for no points for those age groups. They already takecare of those kids and also include development train on squads aligned to the skillaroos but still remain and play with their clubs.

Are those areas for clubs? The Skillaroos are not for our competition it's for the pathway of the FFA not Croydon, Birkalla or Adelaide Hills. 1 year possibly 2 for 80% of them, how many 2013 skillaroos are in the U14 development team?

How many kids get missed? can't afford it? don't have the last name? don't have the support base?

Anyway it doesn't matter this is about the clubs not the FFA, the better we can DEVELOP our clubs means a BETTER comp, more chances for players that might miss out on the ELITIST teams and a better pathway within our clubs for the players, so they see a future within their club (not just talk) and might not jump from club to club.

Which players in the skillaroos, U14 etc team etc still play at club, except keepers?

[The moyesiah]

So each club has 2 x 'Academy' teams, one in each of these age groups .... Plus then all normal Sunday age groups and leagues

Has merit

Kick off times is currently 11am/1pm/3pm .... so really can only squeeze in a 9am game, as most clubs don't have proper lights for 5pm ko
Or, if clubs have 2 pitches, can play another match at 11am, same time as u18s

It can easily work, kick offs 845am & 5pm. Surely most, if not all premier league clubs have approved lights. It would be a cool down game after the seniors, with some of the crowd possibly hanging around, it would all be done and dusted and players home by 7pm.

This way clubs can focus on the players they see as their future and give the feeling they really do have a chance to progress, while also offering a team if you are not at that level, which will keep kids wanting to improve and aim for the development squads.

And the pitches would be in a great shape after 5 matches on a rainy day.

not a lot of difference now, some grounds have 4-5 games a week on them now.

[Željko Jurin]

can someone fill me in here..about the structure...been asking around and cant seem to work it out and have parents telling me my son is training with ..such and such this week..

Are the u/14 skillaroos mainly 12-13 yr old playing in the u/14a comp.?- they have a squad of players not affliated to clubs and also have train on squads?..how many in the train on squads and when do they train?

and u/16's are mainly 14-15 yr olds playing in u/16a comp- do they also have a squad of players not affliated to clubs and also have a train on squad?- how many in the train on squads an when do they train?

the SA NTC playing in the u/18's is what? 16/17 yr olds?..where do they go after

whats STIC- is this the u/12's that just train in squads?

bit confused sorry .

u12 STIC are zoned teams, all players trialling for u13 Skilleroos for the following year

u13 Skilleroos, full time programme, dont play for club (play against u14A JPL teams)
u13 Development Squad, part time programme, do still play for their club

u14 Skilleroos, full time programme, dont play for club (play against u16A JPL teams)
u14 Development Squad, part time programme, do still play for their club

NTC, u15, play in NPL u18 Comp

http://www.ffsa.com.au/fileadmin/user_u ... athway.pdf

Parents think if their child misses u13 Skilleroos their is no hope to get into the system .....
I know of a player a few years back that was in an u12JSL team (B team at his club), made his u12 STIC Zone team, didnt get into Skilleroos at the time
Has done STIC again every year in u13 and u14, and is now a train on player with NTC
(i'm sure there are others in a similar situation)

No one is guaranteed anything, it is a year on year selection process, those that are in have to work hard to stay there, those that are not in can work hard and can be noticed and included

[ikon]

can someone fill me in here..about the structure...been asking around and cant seem to work it out and have parents telling me my son is training with ..such and such this week..

Are the u/14 skillaroos mainly 12-13 yr old playing in the u/14a comp.?- they have a squad of players not affliated to clubs and also have train on squads?..how many in the train on squads and when do they train?

and u/16's are mainly 14-15 yr olds playing in u/16a comp- do they also have a squad of players not affliated to clubs and also have a train on squad?- how many in the train on squads an when do they train?

the SA NTC playing in the u/18's is what? 16/17 yr olds?..where do they go after

whats STIC- is this the u/12's that just train in squads?

bit confused sorry .

u12 STIC are zoned teams, all players trialling for u13 Skilleroos for the following year

u13 Skilleroos, full time programme, dont play for club (play against u14A JPL teams)
u13 Development Squad, part time programme, do still play for their club

u14 Skilleroos, full time programme, dont play for club (play against u16A JPL teams)
u14 Development Squad, part time programme, do still play for their club

NTC, u15, play in NPL u18 Comp

http://www.ffsa.com.au/fileadmin/user_u ... athway.pdf

Parents think if their child misses u13 Skilleroos their is no hope to get into the system .....
I know of a player a few years back that was in an u12JSL team (B team at his club), made his u12 STIC Zone team, didnt get into Skilleroos at the time
Has done STIC again every year in u13 and u14, and is now a train on player with NTC
(i'm sure there are others in a similar situation)

No one is guaranteed anything, it is a year on year selection process, those that are in have to work hard to stay there, those that are not in can work hard and can be noticed and included

Thanks for that Zeljko
Just starting out and just getting my head around things....i always tell the kids/parents if your good enough they will come and get you ....lol.. I did watch the SAP process earlier in the year as i had 6 kids trial and prob another 3 that shouldve but as a club we couldn't send a whole team i guess .. was good to watch and learn as a coach for u/10's and 11's..these kids will now try and get into u/12's STIC zone teams for next year and so on ..am i right?..was interesting to see what they were looking for in this age level though.

I guess parents just want their kids noticed somewhere along the line if they are going to be play at the highest level they can in the future...i think most parents just want the best coaching available and most of the time these teams provide that.

The selection process will always be up for debate i guess

in keeping with the topic it would be good that any players that are trying for these teams are part of a clubs academy as well..so in essence clubs are sending their academy players..

[hooch]

I dont see why a system similar to NSW cannot be introcduced here.
Basically clubs are graded on there performance as a junior setup not as induvidual teams, this is done by a club championship where points accumulated during the season add up to a season total across the entire junior setup.

An sa example would be.
You have a junior premier league and a junior state league
Clubs nominate to be a member of either or both
Each nominated club needs to field under 12,13,14 16
below this you have a junior development league for clubs that have additional teams or clubs that dont want to be in the more serious setup, they would play in a division system based on regions eg south division 1,2 3 etc, or it could be combined into the e&d, Njsa, southern districts etc.

say initially the current senior premier league clubs make up the premier league, each club would need to fill teams as above, all these teams play each other in a home and away draw on the same day.
eg. sunday blue eagles vs metros across all grades 12, 13,14 & 16 (this also means players can easily back up for a higher age group which aids in their development)
At the end of the season the club most consistent across all grades is crowned premier league club champion, the team least consistent across all grades is relegated to the state league and replaced by the club most consistent.

This will encourage clubs that want to develop their juniors to do so, over a period of time say 5 years the best junior clubs will rise to the premier league, it also gives clubs another revenue stream as they have parents and players from both teams at the same venue for the course of the day eg canteen sales etc.

I for one would be interested to see how many of these clubs would actually have senior teams playing in the same league.

[The moyesiah]

I dont see why a system similar to NSW cannot be introcduced here.
Basically clubs are graded on there performance as a junior setup not as induvidual teams, this is done by a club championship where points accumulated during the season add up to a season total across the entire junior setup.

An sa example would be.
You have a junior premier league and a junior state league
Clubs nominate to be a member of either or both
Each nominated club needs to field under 12,13,14 16
below this you have a junior development league for clubs that have additional teams or clubs that dont want to be in the more serious setup, they would play in a division system based on regions eg south division 1,2 3 etc, or it could be combined into the e&d, Njsa, southern districts etc.

say initially the current senior premier league clubs make up the premier league, each club would need to fill teams as above, all these teams play each other in a home and away draw on the same day.
eg. sunday blue eagles vs metros across all grades 12, 13,14 & 16 (this also means players can easily back up for a higher age group which aids in their development)
At the end of the season the club most consistent across all grades is crowned premier league club champion, the team least consistent across all grades is relegated to the state league and replaced by the club most consistent.

This will encourage clubs that want to develop their juniors to do so, over a period of time say 5 years the best junior clubs will rise to the premier league, it also gives clubs another revenue stream as they have parents and players from both teams at the same venue for the course of the day eg canteen sales etc.

I for one would be interested to see how many of these clubs would actually have senior teams playing in the same league.

The only problem with that is, the rich get richer, and the poor get poorer. Of course it is up to clubs to entice players to their teams, however some clubs just can't do that due to location.

[ikon]

some excellent points guys and some good thinking ...

we need let the junior leagues settle for a couple of years...as JD mentioned previously we keep chopping and changing...and calling it the new way ...i think the SSG format has been the biggest change our junior set ups have had in 20 years and is just bearing fruit.

There is no doubt the 12's, 14's, 16's and 18's need to be the focus over the next 2-3 years then look at it again.

[The moyesiah]

Don't get me wrong, but all these things are planned for our World future, SSG / pathways etc. However what is being done to better our clubs / competitions. Not every player can make the pathways, many get lost in a mediocre team and search for greener grass. Smaller clubs that have 4-5 players that have potential in say U13/14 can make one good U14 team, that can compete in an U14 comp, rather than their U13 & U14 teams struggling and the potential end up going to better teams. If they don't enter a 13 or 14 team in the JPL thats fine because they have the U14 development team, I think you would find that clubs would have a better chance to develop these players and hold them in such a structure, vs two mediocre teams losing most weeks. These good players are forced to keep the ball and break team play because they have no faith in their team mates, in the end they go to a team that has this across the majority, not the minority.

[Nice One Cyril]

I posted this on another thread and figured it needed it's own title.

Right now we have the JPL & JSL, why not change this to the JDL & JPL, what is a JDL you ask? Junior Development League, solely for the development of future senior players. In this comp we only have;

U14 containing the best 13&14 yr olds
U16 containing the best 15&16 yr olds

This comp does not have points or leagues and is structured to be played on a Saturday (following their seniors) as curtain raisers to the Saturday events, getting these kids use to the feel of our competition.

These players are not allowed to drop back into the new JPL structure and are registered under a different umbrella and are simply not eligible for the JPL comp. The new JPL structure is for all other players to play for points and leagues and will be listed as Division 1-100. However each JPL team can list say 4 players within the JPL as rookies as such (so U13/14 JPL players would have 4 rookies) if there is a long term injury to a JDL player, clubs can lift these players into that squad, however only if the replaced player is out for longer than 4 or 6 weeks.

This will end the bs of development, because we will have a development team at every club, and the club can hire a specialised coach. The next rule is quite simple, any player registered within the JPL can not go down and only up, so an U13 registered as an U14 can not drop back into the U13 and can only go up again, easily fixing the stacking teams issue.

Now let the abuse and laughter begin

I like the idea of more development places, but the biggest problem would be finding enough coaches without egos, who are happy to concentrate on development rather than their own CV.

[The moyesiah]

I posted this on another thread and figured it needed it's own title.

Right now we have the JPL & JSL, why not change this to the JDL & JPL, what is a JDL you ask? Junior Development League, solely for the development of future senior players. In this comp we only have;

U14 containing the best 13&14 yr olds
U16 containing the best 15&16 yr olds

This comp does not have points or leagues and is structured to be played on a Saturday (following their seniors) as curtain raisers to the Saturday events, getting these kids use to the feel of our competition.

These players are not allowed to drop back into the new JPL structure and are registered under a different umbrella and are simply not eligible for the JPL comp. The new JPL structure is for all other players to play for points and leagues and will be listed as Division 1-100. However each JPL team can list say 4 players within the JPL as rookies as such (so U13/14 JPL players would have 4 rookies) if there is a long term injury to a JDL player, clubs can lift these players into that squad, however only if the replaced player is out for longer than 4 or 6 weeks.

This will end the bs of development, because we will have a development team at every club, and the club can hire a specialised coach. The next rule is quite simple, any player registered within the JPL can not go down and only up, so an U13 registered as an U14 can not drop back into the U13 and can only go up again, easily fixing the stacking teams issue.

Now let the abuse and laughter begin

I like the idea of more development places, but the biggest problem would be finding enough coaches without egos, who are happy to concentrate on development rather than their own CV.

Well that is in the hands of the clubs coaching director, I'm sure a club can get two paid coaches (doesn't have to be much but more than nothing) while still holding their usual volunteer coaches.

Remember these comps will have no leagues, points etc and if their seniors are relegated so are these teams.