JD's about to get very excited

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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by theorakle »

Sacred Noodle wrote:
BeNatural wrote:
johndedes wrote:Shoot goal

My first pair of boots bought in 1968 were Adidas leather.
Bought from a Sports Store in the city of Adelaide on the corner of King William Street and Grenfell St.
CIBO is there now.
My second pair were from Kmart at Kurralta Park.
After that I use to buy my boots from Bailletti from saved up lunch money.
As my first Adidas blue Track Suit, from Bailletti.
Wow you could afford Adidas boots back in the 70s.

I was lucky to have $10 boots back then.
$10 !!! Elitist!! .. I had to put up with studs screwed directly into my feet !!
you lucky bugger. I played in bare feet on a cinder pitch. :wink:

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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by eagleboy »

God is an Englishman wrote:
johndedes wrote:Shoot goal

I am glad I played JPL when it was free.
I thought JPL was only a few years old
John's memory has deserted him. Maybe junior fees were not free either. It was a long time ago. :roll:

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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by Tzon »

Shoot goal

Funny true story:
I have conveyed parts of this on FN before.

At Primary School many of us ethnic lads were forced to play Footy because the School Teacher that was coach was short of players. We were bullied by the Australian lads at the time.
Well, we wore soccer boots. We must of been the first to do so in the games history back then.
After playing together and winning games we all became friends.
Later the same thing happened with playing cricket for the school.

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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by AUFCSPURS »

The attitude of most people on this thread is a joke, paying 1000 dollars a year for substandard training facilities, coaches and equipment is a joke, and don't give this insurance crap. The process of going through insurance for an injury is a joke. I hope these 'mercenary' players keep raping these NPL clubs for as much money as they can as thats exactly what they deserve. Charging 1000 dollars upwards for juniors to play is a scam and a half.

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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by GaylyColouredStumps »

AUFCSPURS wrote:The attitude of most people on this thread is a joke, paying 1000 dollars a year for substandard training facilities, coaches and equipment is a joke, and don't give this insurance crap. The process of going through insurance for an injury is a joke. I hope these 'mercenary' players keep raping these NPL clubs for as much money as they can as thats exactly what they deserve. Charging 1000 dollars upwards for juniors to play is a scam and a half.
It's juniors funding their future selves. Little Johnny will get what he can when he's a senior and little Kenny will pay for it. Then one day little Kenny will become a senior, get as much as he can and little Billy will fund it. And so goes the circle of life.

The club is just the conduit and isn't the one getting raped.
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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by BruceLee »

Sacred Noodle wrote:Personally cant see the issue with juniors funding seniors if that happens to any extent .. yeah clubs should be about developing players but at the end of the day it is the senior first team that the club is about and where the kids would be aspiring to be ... assume it takes a lot of $$ to keep successful top league clubs afloat .. its the nature of the beast world wide players are paid a lot more than in the past so really it all becomes relative.

Also wouldn't of had all the liabilities, insurances FFA FFSA requirements in the past that are part of the system in place today.

How many kids at clubs regularly go and support the first team?? not many!! if more got behind the club in that way maybe fees wouldn't need to be as high .. kids want to be at relatively elite level clubs and so that would come at a necessary cost as it would cost a lot more to run an elite level cub in comparison to an lower level club that may have juniors.

Also have seen so many times players both at junior and those coming into the senior levels ie U18s etc who are stereotyped as being from lower socio-economic back grounds and cant or don't pay fees .. yet rock up in football boots that cost $400+ !!

Well why is it only us and America who have these crazy fees? And are both cabernet btw. Senior football? State league football is amateur football. Kids should aspire to that? Jesus I played senior state league and I was terrible

Sorry dude normally enjoy your posts but our junior system is fukd. Totally. Any future success will be a slow grind

I miss Johnny Warren. Sometimes I feel like Australian football died with him rather than the new beginning we thought it was

Just sad and disappointing

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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by N5 1BH »

Gee they hid this one away quick. Acknowledge that some of the better players are only playing because of Gov. refugee assistance yet still rationalize that no one could be missing out, amazing.

Given the cost of living pressures in the big eastern cities what proportion of working class families have up to $3000 per child to waste on a sport. My brother in law in Sydney has 3 kids who aren’t playing jpl purely down to cost. I challenge anyone to come up with a single tangible benefit of this stupid system, there is no logic to it on any level especially given that all the rival codes internally and counterparts internationally are using variations of accepted best practice mass participation merit based pathways.

The FFA is obviously going to allow all this to continue, I can see the eastern A league clubs (note: who don’t charge) eventually lose patience with getting left behind and form associations with the sensibly priced regional & community leagues, help out with coaching education etc. This is where the better prospects are coming from now anyway, bypass the FFA & NPL.

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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by GaylyColouredStumps »

There seems to be many parents that can't afford the high fees. Serious question, why can't ten of these parents get together. Join the committee of their local club. Slowly take over the club and implement a low cost junior strategy.

Really wouldn't be hard to work your way into many club committees and make the change. Would take just one club to lead the way and prove it can be done.
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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by N5 1BH »

Mmm would of thought the less parental interference into the running of a semi pro football club the better. Is it a case of cart before horse anyway, the parents currently at the club are there because they are able & willing to pay up so fees & increased competition for places wouldn’t be in their list of priorities what with them getting on committees mainly to cement their kids places. Focus should be on first attracting the parents of the kids the game will currently never see.

Little a handful of uneducated parents can do anyhow, how can you convince a club to change when there is absolutely no incentive to change. On the contrary there is no structure or form to this league, it cannibalizes itself and the amount of tapping up and poaching that goes on is insane. Could develop the best youth squad in history and they walk for nothing to another club, club is left out of pocket and down in div 3, it’s unworkable and would be suicide in the current climate. Culture needs to change throughout beginning with FFA. Re incentivise development, discourage poaching by enforcing tapping up rules, structuring proper compensation $$$$ for other clubs to use your junior products and fair transfer fees- all including to A league clubs. It’s simple, semi pro clubs are in business and junior development is risk and reward but the only reward currently available to most clubs in the NPL seems to be the fees.

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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by GaylyColouredStumps »

N5 1BH wrote:
Little a handful of uneducated parents can do anyhow, how can you convince a club to change when there is absolutely no incentive to change.

Once you have control of the committee, you are the club.

Who will will block a move to make junior fees lower?
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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by N5 1BH »

Sorry I’m not with you, in what scenario do random parents not currently involved at a club because of cost somehow form an alliance and assume control of its committee. Doesn't seem practical. I do know there are committee members at non fed clubs who would like to enter their own low cost juniors given the opportunity.

I remember a few years ago when some existing parents took control of a fed club, resulting in juniors trying to run seniors. No idea the motivation behind that but it didn’t seem to end well coz the clubs gone.

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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by GaylyColouredStumps »

So I guess it's too hard to get a club to somehow have low junior fees. Nobody has the will nor the way, that includes people already involved in clubs and people that aren't.
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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by N5 1BH »

Yep I guess you’re right apart from of course for the thousands of low cost junior teams and their volunteers operating outside the npl cartel. Look if your happy with the direction and standard of your league and national team carry on as you are, what the hell I like a good train wreck.

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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by GaylyColouredStumps »

N5 1BH wrote:Yep I guess you’re right apart from of course for the thousands of low cost junior teams and their volunteers operating outside the npl cartel. Look if your happy with the direction and standard of your league and national team carry on as you are, what the hell I like a good train wreck.
Direction and standard of league and national team is a separate issue.

If there are thousands of other options, what's the issue?
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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by N5 1BH »

I appreciate your style of putting leading questions to make a point but we are just back to square one now.

So to sum up, for me putting an unnecessary financial barrier on junior education / development is not something I could ever support or want to be associated with. It short changes the game, the kids & the supporters, it just makes no sense. No professional football coach worth his salt would believe that given 15 kids @ $2000+ impost each put into a league system of the same would generate enough depth to achieve anything of note. Of course you can counter this if you like with a list of notable players from the big npl clubs in recent times, even one name would do.

Grassroots will look after itself, it’s the easy part. But at the end of the day the A league & your npl are in the sports entertainment business, their remit is to put out a product that engages and entertains the punters. You think they are currently maximizing talent identification to this end, I’ve seen no evidence of it.

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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by GaylyColouredStumps »

I'm not saying it should be expensive. I'm not saying it shouldn't be accessible to everyone. I'm saying there are plenty of plenty that say the clubs are doing it wrong, let's see just one group formed to show it can be done "correctly"
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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by Bomber »

Sunny Vanilla wrote:I'm not saying it should be expensive. I'm not saying it shouldn't be accessible to everyone. I'm saying there are plenty of plenty that say the clubs are doing it wrong, let's see just one group formed to show it can be done "correctly"
Been saying that for years. I recall Toros tried a "cheap fee" structure to lure juniors once. How did that go?

Until a club comes up with a near perfect model, and if successful, I'm sure more will follow suit.
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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by N5 1BH »

That’s the thing it can’t just come from one club, the ‘group’ needs to be the league. To make development a viable option as a priority there needs to be a legitimate academy grading system in place with training contracts & rules that are adhered to. The bluntest way would be for the FFA to put a cap on junior fees but without adequate incentives in place it would still achieve little. Has to be reward for doing the right thing via best case -keeping hold of your better prospects for your supporters. Or at the very least getting cash compo to reinvest e.g maybe. $5000 per year spent at club from U9 – U17 for any club that takes a 21 & under player.

As far as a single club, well Vista are easy the best priced round our way and with a direct connection to grassroots E&D, so maybe keep an eye on them see how they go.

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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by GaylyColouredStumps »

N5 1BH wrote:That’s the thing it can’t just come from one club, the ‘group’ needs to be the league. To make development a viable option as a priority there needs to be a legitimate academy grading system in place with training contracts & rules that are adhered to. The bluntest way would be for the FFA to put a cap on junior fees but without adequate incentives in place it would still achieve little. Has to be reward for doing the right thing via best case -keeping hold of your better prospects for your supporters. Or at the very least getting cash compo to reinvest e.g maybe. $5000 per year spent at club from U9 – U17 for any club that takes a 21 & under player.

As far as a single club, well Vista are easy the best priced round our way and with a direct connection to grassroots E&D, so maybe keep an eye on them see how they go.
Hang on, the lack of money is supposedly due to junior fees being used to pay seniors.

The only handicap Vista will have is arguably a poor senior team should they wish to make junior fees affordable. There's no reason they can't just focus on development at an affordable price provided they are comfortable that they won't get promoted to the top division.
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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by N5 1BH »

The lack of money is because you currently have a poor product with virtually unsaleable assets (players) and pissing more money out the top on wages than is coming in. That’s money leaving the game altogether rather than being recycled. Is the high wages due to relentless poaching, is the relentless poaching due to lack of outstanding players, is the lack of outstanding players due to…..? Under this system what is to be gained for any club to actually invest in real terms, in junior development, why would anyone want to lose out to the benefit a rival for no remuneration. That would be plain daft.

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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by GaylyColouredStumps »

N5 1BH wrote:The lack of money is because you currently have a poor product with virtually unsaleable assets (players) and pissing more money out the top on wages than is coming in. That’s money leaving the game altogether rather than being recycled. Is the high wages due to relentless poaching, is the relentless poaching due to lack of outstanding players, is the lack of outstanding players due to…..? Under this system what is to be gained for any club to actually invest in real terms, in junior development, why would anyone want to lose out to the benefit a rival for no remuneration. That would be plain daft.
I agree with you.

But the fact is, we could have the exact same system, but where a club pays their seniors sweet fa and charges low junior fees. Why does not one club out there do this?
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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by God is an Englishman »

Sunny Vanilla wrote:
N5 1BH wrote:The lack of money is because you currently have a poor product with virtually unsaleable assets (players) and pissing more money out the top on wages than is coming in. That’s money leaving the game altogether rather than being recycled. Is the high wages due to relentless poaching, is the relentless poaching due to lack of outstanding players, is the lack of outstanding players due to…..? Under this system what is to be gained for any club to actually invest in real terms, in junior development, why would anyone want to lose out to the benefit a rival for no remuneration. That would be plain daft.
I agree with you.

But the fact is, we could have the exact same system, but where a club pays their seniors sweet fa and charges low junior fees. Why does not one club out there do this?
Pretty much what Vista (and probably a lot of SL2 clubs) are doing.
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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by GaylyColouredStumps »

God is an Englishman wrote:
Sunny Vanilla wrote:
N5 1BH wrote:The lack of money is because you currently have a poor product with virtually unsaleable assets (players) and pissing more money out the top on wages than is coming in. That’s money leaving the game altogether rather than being recycled. Is the high wages due to relentless poaching, is the relentless poaching due to lack of outstanding players, is the lack of outstanding players due to…..? Under this system what is to be gained for any club to actually invest in real terms, in junior development, why would anyone want to lose out to the benefit a rival for no remuneration. That would be plain daft.
I agree with you.

But the fact is, we could have the exact same system, but where a club pays their seniors sweet fa and charges low junior fees. Why does not one club out there do this?
Pretty much what Vista (and probably a lot of SL2 clubs) are doing.
How much are Vista fees?
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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by God is an Englishman »

They vary determined by which side/league you are playing in.

Federation Juniors - significantly cheaper than the clubs near them.
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Re: JD's about to get very excited

Post by GaylyColouredStumps »

God is an Englishman wrote:They vary determined by which side/league you are playing in.

Federation Juniors - significantly cheaper than the clubs near them.
Fed junior U12 for example?
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