Lady Reds Coach To Quit

[sportsbird]

Otto62,
It was never about me.
It was about how he treated players, club officials, coaches etc with arrogance and disrespect.
Glad to see the back of him.
Hope he never returns to women's football.

[juniorsupporter]

I know this will provoke a lengthy response from at least one forumite. But Ross showed the girls what was possible and taught them what was necessary to progress to the next level. There are many who would play for him again in a heartbeat, including some of the biggest names in the women's game in Australia. A huge loss for the women's game both here in SA and at the national level. I wish him all the best.

[snow white]

With Ross's departure (a very significant loss in my books, given his credentials and strong connection to the Mathilda's), who is running the show??? Given Ross's world cup this year, he has barely been present.

I have grave concerns for the Lady Reds this upcoming season. We have lost a host of key players and Ross would have been well placed to recruit some young Mathilda's at least, if not more senior.

I've got no doubt that part of Barbieri's decision to not return to Adelaide was she knew that Ross would not be returning.

Much of our best young talent has packed their bags and are either interstate, wanting to trail to interstate or off to the USA.

The current FFSA side is light years off W League, so much will rest on what is left in the NTC squad which would have been hit by quite a few departures and its asking too much to expect them to step up to W League standard without the experience and leadership of the likes of Moore and Barbieri around them.

The Premier League is the weakest in living memory, and many of the senior players still plying their trade, have been burn't by previous negative W League experiences and as a result, many will not jump at the chance to join the squad.

Unless the FFSA moves exceptionally quickly to appoint an experienced Head of football with good contacts both locally, interstate and internationally, its going to be yet another long, long W League season.

[MilhouseGumble]

[Lucas Leiva]

With Ross's departure (a very significant loss in my books, given his credentials and strong connection to the Mathilda's), who is running the show??? Given Ross's world cup this year, he has barely been present.

I have grave concerns for the Lady Reds this upcoming season. We have lost a host of key players and Ross would have been well placed to recruit some young Mathilda's at least, if not more senior.

I've got no doubt that part of Barbieri's decision to not return to Adelaide was she knew that Ross would not be returning.

Much of our best young talent has packed their bags and are either interstate, wanting to trail to interstate or off to the USA.

The current FFSA side is light years off W League, so much will rest on what is left in the NTC squad which would have been hit by quite a few departures and its asking too much to expect them to step up to W League standard without the experience and leadership of the likes of Moore and Barbieri around them.

The Premier League is the weakest in living memory, and many of the senior players still plying their trade, have been burn't by previous negative W League experiences and as a result, many will not jump at the chance to join the squad.

Unless the FFSA moves exceptionally quickly to appoint an experienced Head of football with good contacts both locally, interstate and internationally, its going to be yet another long, long W League season.

I'm not defending any parties here, but keep in mind that from a W League perspective Adelaide United is predominantly competing against clubs financially supported by the club under which they play. Perth Glory, Melbourne Victory, Melbourne City et al have and will continue to benefit from funding that just simply doesn't exist for AU.

The quality of coaching is a factor in decision making for experienced players, but it's not the only factor. Senior Matildas who hold annual contracts with the FFA (which is a pittance) will be looking to enhance that if they have to move interstate and away from their alternative jobs. Barbs may have felt a connection to Ross' coaching but she had to flog off a lot of memorabilia to support her time here.

[snow white]

With Ross's departure (a very significant loss in my books, given his credentials and strong connection to the Mathilda's), who is running the show??? Given Ross's world cup this year, he has barely been present.

I have grave concerns for the Lady Reds this upcoming season. We have lost a host of key players and Ross would have been well placed to recruit some young Mathilda's at least, if not more senior.

I've got no doubt that part of Barbieri's decision to not return to Adelaide was she knew that Ross would not be returning.

Much of our best young talent has packed their bags and are either interstate, wanting to trail to interstate or off to the USA.

The current FFSA side is light years off W League, so much will rest on what is left in the NTC squad which would have been hit by quite a few departures and its asking too much to expect them to step up to W League standard without the experience and leadership of the likes of Moore and Barbieri around them.

The Premier League is the weakest in living memory, and many of the senior players still plying their trade, have been burn't by previous negative W League experiences and as a result, many will not jump at the chance to join the squad.

Unless the FFSA moves exceptionally quickly to appoint an experienced Head of football with good contacts both locally, interstate and internationally, its going to be yet another long, long W League season.

I'm not defending any parties here, but keep in mind that from a W League perspective Adelaide United is predominantly competing against clubs financially supported by the club under which they play. Perth Glory, Melbourne Victory, Melbourne City et al have and will continue to benefit from funding that just simply doesn't exist for AU.

The quality of coaching is a factor in decision making for experienced players, but it's not the only factor. Senior Matildas who hold annual contracts with the FFA (which is a pittance) will be looking to enhance that if they have to move interstate and away from their alternative jobs. Barbs may have felt a connection to Ross' coaching but she had to flog off a lot of memorabilia to support her time here.

Lucas, I've got no doubt that money talks and Melbourne City would be the new exception, but we aren't even retaining our best young local talent and we just lost a coach who had the reputation and direct connection with all the Mathilda's and younger aussie teams.

Our chances of recruiting some high calibre players to complement our local players is now greatly diminished, with or without $$$$.

I doubt the likes of Newcastle are funded heavily by the parent club who are struggling to pay the bills for the men. Brisbane would now be in the same boat with serious financial issues, yet Newcastle as one example, was able to rebuild last season with a competitive side after finishing dead last the year before.

Losing Ross at this point of the year is a very serious blow, whether you like his style of coaching and player management or not. Whoever steps up will have a real challenge on our hands.

[Unretired]

Canberra United have never had the backing of any mens club and will continue not to but have matched it every year in the w-league. They actually have someone working on obtaining sponsorship not waiting for sponsors to come to them.

In saying that every other club in the W-League pay their players even if it is a token amount.. AU is the only club that doesn't.

I hope that AU come out of this and can attract decent players but I find it highly unlikely...I assume once again they will be searching for a coach with only weeks to go before the season unless of course there is always DE who is out of a job at the moment.

[sportsbird]

Unretired,

I think you will find that Adelaide United do pay the players.
Unfortunately, the only players AU pay are the overseas players.
Great to see our locals are getting looked after.

[juniorsupporter]

How exactly, Sportsbird, are the locals being "looked after"? Aside from being offered contracts. Are they being paid?

[snow white]

How exactly, Sportsbird, are the locals being "looked after"? Aside from being offered contracts. Are they being paid?

I think Sportsbird is being sarcastic in his/her response.

[juniorsupporter]

Ah. Shocker. My bad. Thought sportsbird might know something. That I didn't, that is.

[sportsbird]

snow white
I am not being sarcastic. it is a known fact that local players are not getting paid.
Also there are people in the women's football circle who were unhappy with the way RA left in such circumstances after being heavily invested. Maybe that is why there was no official farewell party.
In addition, interim NTC coach Pezos will also be leaving the NTC at the end of this season.
The latest news is that next season the NTC will play in the new NPL women's premier League and the under 14/15's in the reserves. The under 13's in the under 17's.
Finally they have got it right.
Welcome to sportsbird corner.

[snow white]

snow white
I am not being sarcastic. it is a known fact that local players are not getting paid.
Also there are people in the women's football circle who were unhappy with the way RA left in such circumstances after being heavily invested. Maybe that is why there was no official farewell party.
In addition, interim NTC coach Pezos will also be leaving the NTC at the end of this season.
The latest news is that next season the NTC will play in the new NPL women's premier League and the under 14/15's in the reserves. The under 13's in the under 17's.
Finally they have got it right.
Welcome to sportsbird corner.

When you wrote 'Great to see our locals are getting looked after', I interpreted that as sarcasm, as your point was, the internationals get paid and our local girls are neglected.

I noted that in the press release that welcomed Harnwell, there wasn't a single mention of RA. Not even a thanks or a goodbye, which is very unusual, so my first instinct is to think its either a very poor oversight or both parties did not part amicably.

If the structural changes you noted are correct, then those FFSA teams will be alot more competitive in their new divisions, but I wonder how the local clubs will feel when they actuall absorb the impact, which isn't really noted today, a the FFSA teams are largely uncompetitive. Afterall, not only do they lose the cream of their playing crop to the FFSA at multiple age levels every, their fees subsidize a direct opponent who will now take alot more points off them. Strange way in my books to run a competition in, directly competing against teams entered by the very entity you pay to run and administer the league.

Surely there is another way.

[juniorsupporter]

I'm not sure that the fees paid by clubs subsidise the elite programs- the u14's and U13's pay fees to FFSA for the season. The NTC players benefit from government funds that used to go to SASI before the soccer programs were eliminated. Only recently have the NTC players been asked to pay, and I believe that has to do with a conditioning coach who has been brought on board.

Secondly, if the goal of the elite programs is to get girls into national squads (which it is) they need to play in environments that challenge them- boys' comps are faster and more physical- not sure how the 13's did this year, but the NTC girls were competitive in the u15b JPL comp. you don't want to put these elite girls teams in competitions where they'll dominate, that's not the point.
The placement of these teams problematic and the results will vary year to year- just because the 15's had a bad year, for whatever reason, isn't a reason to scrap the whole thing. I think the only adjustment that needs to be made is that the u15's need to play against boys. U14 maybe. But to put the NTC girls in the Prems would be ridiculous.

[snow white]

I'm not sure that the fees paid by clubs subsidise the elite programs- the u14's and U13's pay fees to FFSA for the season. The NTC players benefit from government funds that used to go to SASI before the soccer programs were eliminated. Only recently have the NTC players been asked to pay, and I believe that has to do with a conditioning coach who has been brought on board.

Secondly, if the goal of the elite programs is to get girls into national squads (which it is) they need to play in environments that challenge them- boys' comps are faster and more physical- not sure how the 13's did this year, but the NTC girls were competitive in the u15b JPL comp. you don't want to put these elite girls teams in competitions where they'll dominate, that's not the point.
The placement of these teams problematic and the results will vary year to year- just because the 15's had a bad year, for whatever reason, isn't a reason to scrap the whole thing. I think the only adjustment that needs to be made is that the u15's need to play against boys. U14 maybe. But to put the NTC girls in the Prems would be ridiculous.

The club fees go into general revenue (and most likely the very same bank account). Part of that revenue raised from the clubs then goes to partly paying for all FFSA costs, including the running of the FFSA teams. Does it cover the full amount? Who knows and its neither relevant. Point is, clubs pay fees to the FFSA to run their competition, only for the FFSA to cherry pick the cream of the talent and then compete against the very teams they are meant to be servicing.

Its akin to the FFA or AFL entering their own sides to compete against their own stakeholder clubs, and after they have set the rules and taken the best players (without any compensation I might add). There would be an uproar if this ever happened.

You should travel to Europe or South America JS to see how 'football development' is undertaken by the two (by far) most successful footballing continents in the world, where the best players ever have developed and where the biggest clubs and competitions are staged. You will find that development is actually done largely by the clubs, not imposed from 'above' by the governing body.

There are proven football development models throughout the world that are hugely successful and do not involve taking 25-30% of the playing pool out of an already diminished pool, and then make those players compete against their clubs in the same competition.

Think outside the box JS and see what the rest of the football world is doing. Developing local coaches would be a great start by offering free ASIA license courses to coaches who meet certain criteria. If you are truly serious about taking the world game in this nation to the next level, you need to have a big pool of coaches who are actually able to teach technique with the right philosophy and those coaches must largely sit outside the realm of the FFSA, otherwise your only cater for a very small percentage of the playing population. FFSA need to set benchmarks for coaches, but then need to take away the obstacles to those benchmarks. Costs would be a pretty good starter. Thats if you are serious about development. Greta players start with very good technical coaches.

Have a look at the stats in Spain. They have more UEFA A License coaches than any other country and it takes longer their to obtain the A license than say England, and the vast bulk of those coaches are with clubs, not the Spanish Federation. The results on the pitch and football philosophy in Spain speaks for itself.

Once again it comes back to the developing the grassroots. The policy of taking these 'elite' players out of the clubs and leaving the clubs neglected is short sighted and against world trends.

[juniorsupporter]

I was only commenting on the system as it currently exists- obviously there are better models out there. The changes you mention would take a long time in transition and many of the changes you mention aren't within the ffsa's responsibility but rather the ffa's. That's not to say that change isn't needed- the current system clearly has flaws that need addressing with regards to both the players and the local clubs.

[sportsbird]

I'm not sure that the fees paid by clubs subsidise the elite programs- the u14's and U13's pay fees to FFSA for the season. The NTC players benefit from government funds that used to go to SASI before the soccer programs were eliminated. Only recently have the NTC players been asked to pay, and I believe that has to do with a conditioning coach who has been brought on board.

Secondly, if the goal of the elite programs is to get girls into national squads (which it is) they need to play in environments that challenge them- boys' comps are faster and more physical- not sure how the 13's did this year, but the NTC girls were competitive in the u15b JPL comp. you don't want to put these elite girls teams in competitions where they'll dominate, that's not the point.
The placement of these teams problematic and the results will vary year to year- just because the 15's had a bad year, for whatever reason, isn't a reason to scrap the whole thing. I think the only adjustment that needs to be made is that the u15's need to play against boys. U14 maybe. But to put the NTC girls in the Prems would be ridiculous.

The club fees go into general revenue (and most likely the very same bank account). Part of that revenue raised from the clubs then goes to partly paying for all FFSA costs, including the running of the FFSA teams. Does it cover the full amount? Who knows and its neither relevant. Point is, clubs pay fees to the FFSA to run their competition, only for the FFSA to cherry pick the cream of the talent and then compete against the very teams they are meant to be servicing.

Its akin to the FFA or AFL entering their own sides to compete against their own stakeholder clubs, and after they have set the rules and taken the best players (without any compensation I might add). There would be an uproar if this ever happened.

You should travel to Europe or South America JS to see how 'football development' is undertaken by the two (by far) most successful footballing continents in the world, where the best players ever have developed and where the biggest clubs and competitions are staged. You will find that development is actually done largely by the clubs, not imposed from 'above' by the governing body.

There are proven football development models throughout the world that are hugely successful and do not involve taking 25-30% of the playing pool out of an already diminished pool, and then make those players compete against their clubs in the same competition.

Think outside the box JS and see what the rest of the football world is doing. Developing local coaches would be a great start by offering free ASIA license courses to coaches who meet certain criteria. If you are truly serious about taking the world game in this nation to the next level, you need to have a big pool of coaches who are actually able to teach technique with the right philosophy and those coaches must largely sit outside the realm of the FFSA, otherwise your only cater for a very small percentage of the playing population. FFSA need to set benchmarks for coaches, but then need to take away the obstacles to those benchmarks. Costs would be a pretty good starter. Thats if you are serious about development. Greta players start with very good technical coaches.

Have a look at the stats in Spain. They have more UEFA A License coaches than any other country and it takes longer their to obtain the A license than say England, and the vast bulk of those coaches are with clubs, not the Spanish Federation. The results on the pitch and football philosophy in Spain speaks for itself.

Once again it comes back to the developing the grassroots. The policy of taking these 'elite' players out of the clubs and leaving the clubs neglected is short sighted and against world trends.

snow white you are totally correct.
I don't need to say no more.

[SAD GAL]

Stacks of good comments here....unfortunately there's never any good news on the womens football front escpecially in SA.

What I've manged to garner from here in are the following perenial issues:

Local prems league is substandard
Players burnt by past experiences with W League don't wnat anything to do with it
Interstate players possibly not returning (or we can only attract thos we pay $$$ or couldn't get a spot interstate)
Locally based palyers leaving the state to pursue opportunities interstate or overseas
Some like the fact that Ross has left others feel he left a hole
Local players don't get paid to play with Reds whilst interstate or overseas players do.

After months away from here not only is the local league shot teh W League team is hanging by a thread.

Back to the Future moment again.

NOTHING POSITIVE

[snow white]

Stacks of good comments here....unfortunately there's never any good news on the womens football front escpecially in SA.

What I've manged to garner from here in are the following perenial issues:

Local prems league is substandard
Players burnt by past experiences with W League don't wnat anything to do with it
Interstate players possibly not returning (or we can only attract thos we pay $$$ or couldn't get a spot interstate)
Locally based palyers leaving the state to pursue opportunities interstate or overseas
Some like the fact that Ross has left others feel he left a hole
Local players don't get paid to play with Reds whilst interstate or overseas players do.

After months away from here not only is the local league shot teh W League team is hanging by a thread.

Back to the Future moment again.

NOTHING POSITIVE

Accurate summary of the current state of play.

[snow white]

I was only commenting on the system as it currently exists- obviously there are better models out there. The changes you mention would take a long time in transition and many of the changes you mention aren't within the ffsa's responsibility but rather the ffa's. That's not to say that change isn't needed- the current system clearly has flaws that need addressing with regards to both the players and the local clubs.

'Obviously better models out there' ... not obvious to FFSA it seems.

But therein lies the issue. The clubs are essentially revenue raisers despite being the fundamental reason why the sport exists. The clubs have no say in the running of their comp. They get an opportunity to provide 'feedback' annually, but there stops their ability to govern their very own competition.

Is taking the cream of junior talent from every age level out of their clubs into FFSA sides that compete against their clubs, a FFA mandate or a local decision???

The current system has more than flaws. Its fundamentally broken. Grassroots is dying a slow death despite being told 'it's the fastest growing female sport' ... where is the growth??? Whatever good talent we are producing, can't get out of the State quick enough and do we blame them?? Its been drummed into them that the local leagues and coaches are sub-standard.

The standard of the local leagues is the poorest ive seen ever and I've followed the game through my daughter for over 10 years. The remaining senior players are largely disenchanted and burn't by previous experiences and as previously noted the cream of our youth talent is walking interstate or overseas.

The only beneficiaries of the current broken system are the FFSA and those very few players who make it to the various young Mathilda squads. The rest of the NTC/FFSA players are mere training fodder, useful for a one week, once a year tournament and for training sessions the rest of the year. Where will the bulk of the NTC players be in the next 2-3 years. Looking at past generations, they wont even be playing the game. But alas, there will be the next generation of gullible parents willing to part with much time and money to replace the previous burn't out generation.

Providing cost free ASIA licences to coaches who meet a criteria would take a 'long transition'?? I think not. Chanegs can be made immediately.

If the rumours are true that the clubs will be slapped with a $12k annual fee (not beyond the realms of possibility given the men pay $20k annually), aside from the huge financial repercussions this will have on the women's clubs, run by an ever diminishing pool of extremely hardworking volunteers) you will have the situiation where clubs will pay $12k upfront (plus other costs), to have the 'honour' of competing in a comp where they don't decide the rules, there best players are taken without compensation by the governing body and then they must compete on the pitch against sides run by the same governing body, funded (in part) by the clubs. Will the FFSA have to charge itself the $12k fee????

Oh, I forget too, the infrastructure requirements that are coming our way as well i.e. player races, fenced grounds etc, 100 lux lighting. I hope the clubs have hundreds of thousands saved up in the kitty

Soon it will be the FFSA versus the FFSA in a 4 team comp.

We won't talk about the Lady reds and their current situation.

Amateur league is growing more appealing by the day.

[scipio africanus]

In hindsight, we should have stayed as SAWSA.

[SAD GAL]

Pick your poison kind of scenario!!!

In hindsight, we should have stayed as SAWSA.

[scipio africanus]

Pick your poison kind of scenario!!!

In hindsight, we should have stayed as SAWSA.

the lesser of two evils ;)

[Unretired]

Ive heard "rumours" that next year they will have an 8 team NWPL comp that will be played on a Friday night at West Lakes and The Parks....

And that anyone going to watch has to pay to get in....

This will take out the problems of fencing and will bring in more revenue for FFSA.

[scipio africanus]

Ive heard "rumours" that next year they will have an 8 team NWPL comp that will be played on a Friday night at West Lakes and The Parks....

And that anyone going to watch has to pay to get in....

This will take out the problems of fencing and will bring in more revenue for FFSA.

Yes, alot more revenue for FFSA with entry fees and food & beverage, but the clubs lose another stream of revenue being their own canteen takings.

Double whammy would be to do this AND impose a $12k annual club affiliation fee.

Watch player fees goes up substantially next year to make up the shortfall.

FFSA coffers will be happy though

[Playthewhistle]

What is being proposed is actually for the clubs to rotate managing the canteen on those nights and taking the revenue, I believe it is still just a proposal that FFSA are trying to get approval for.

Friday nights would have its drawbacks sure, but does open up the game for a lot more people to go and watch including other clubs and teams in the social div's etc. Also having a few games on at once will also attract more people so it has a lot of positives in my opinion, as well as the fact it gives a good standard to facilities across the teams and allows us to move forward with the NPL which is set out by FFA.

And the $10k-$12k affiliation fee is completely not true, this is the case for Football VIC, will not be the case here in SA, it will be no where near the $10k mark.

[scipio africanus]

What is being proposed is actually for the clubs to rotate managing the canteen on those nights and taking the revenue, I believe it is still just a proposal that FFSA are trying to get approval for.

Friday nights would have its drawbacks sure, but does open up the game for a lot more people to go and watch including other clubs and teams in the social div's etc. Also having a few games on at once will also attract more people so it has a lot of positives in my opinion, as well as the fact it gives a good standard to facilities across the teams and allows us to move forward with the NPL which is set out by FFA.

And the $10k-$12k affiliation fee is completely not true, this is the case for Football VIC, will not be the case here in SA, it will be no where near the $10k mark.

So when is the FFSA going to FORMALLY consult with the clubs or will they make their decision and then hand down the verdict to the clubs??

For changes of this magnitude you need to bring the stakeholders along with you, not impose from above.

Working committees should have been established long ago if FFSA were open to a bi-partisan approach with the clubs.

[Worthless Gobemouche]

What is being proposed is actually for the clubs to rotate managing the canteen on those nights and taking the revenue, I believe it is still just a proposal that FFSA are trying to get approval for.

Friday nights would have its drawbacks sure, but does open up the game for a lot more people to go and watch including other clubs and teams in the social div's etc. Also having a few games on at once will also attract more people so it has a lot of positives in my opinion, as well as the fact it gives a good standard to facilities across the teams and allows us to move forward with the NPL which is set out by FFA.

And the $10k-$12k affiliation fee is completely not true, this is the case for Football VIC, will not be the case here in SA, it will be no where near the $10k mark.

So when is the FFSA going to FORMALLY consult with the clubs or will they make their decision and then hand down the verdict to the clubs??

For changes of this magnitude you need to bring the stakeholders along with you, not impose from above.

Working committees should have been established long ago if FFSA were open to a bi-partisan approach with the clubs.

I'm pretty sure there has been initial consultation with the clubs. They were asked to keep all discussions confidential at this stage.

Sh1t, that appears to have lasted all of 2.5 weeks

[Black_Panther]

Didn't Harnwell win the WLeague with Perth last year??

How isn't that a positive???

[SAD GAL]

I recommdn this "carnival" type of thing about 8-10 years ago. Basically the rationale behinf=d MY suggestions was there is scope to play games at one venue so the costs asssociated with the upkeep of venues can be consolidated. Faciltiies can be upgraded ie revienue can be consolidated to improve amenities. Womens clubs cannot go it alone. Don't have the population to generate income from. Amenities across the board are poor.

The other big thing is that it will be easier to promote the carnival of games. Stand alone games can be lonely and lacklustre.

Thirdly, having multiple games on will increase the interaction amongst clubs.

Standing alone will spell the end for many. Consolidation is the way to go. Better facilities, better exposure will only improve the standing of the sport. Have a look at court based womens sports. Theer's a positive vibe. Ours is the opposite.

Ive heard "rumours" that next year they will have an 8 team NWPL comp that will be played on a Friday night at West Lakes and The Parks....

And that anyone going to watch has to pay to get in....

This will take out the problems of fencing and will bring in more revenue for FFSA.

Yes, alot more revenue for FFSA with entry fees and food & beverage, but the clubs lose another stream of revenue being their own canteen takings.

Double whammy would be to do this AND impose a $12k annual club affiliation fee.

Watch player fees goes up substantially next year to make up the shortfall.

FFSA coffers will be happy though