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Watching the footage at any speed you can clearly see he goes for the ball on purpose with his arm in order to stop it. He watches the ball until a split second before it hits his glove. How anyone could say he was just reacting needs to have an eye exam. If you are reacting to protect yourself your limbs go towards your body not away from it, its basic reaction instinct.

Cooper wrote:Watching the footage at any speed you can clearly see he goes for the ball on purpose with his arm in order to stop it. He watches the ball until a split second before it hits his glove. How anyone could say he was just reacting needs to have an eye exam. If you are reacting to protect yourself your limbs go towards your body not away from it, its basic reaction instinct.

Ha! thought this was done with.

When avoiding a projectile (or punch) your defensive hand will naturally continue to follow the trajectory of the offending object as you turn your body away from it. Even so if what you allege were true, starc was say a generous 15 yards from Stokes, it took about 0.5secs from throw to Stokes’s hand so the ball was travelling 15 yards at about 60 miles/hour. Stokes would have had to mentally assess the situation, look which way the ball is going, decide on a deliberate action and then physically move his body in such a way so as to complete a one handed save behind him. All in 0.5 secs, with pads on his legs and a bat in his other hand. All while having no reflex self protection instinct.

Interesting how aussies are prepared to call Stokes a liar but are more than happy to give voges & neville the benefit of the doubt about whether they knew where their hands were when they grounded the ball , even with a longer reaction time plus the benefit of afterthought.

Heres a test for ya. See how quick you can move one finger a couple of cm
http://getyourwebsitehere.com/jswb/rttest01.html

N5 1BH wrote:

Cooper wrote:Watching the footage at any speed you can clearly see he goes for the ball on purpose with his arm in order to stop it. He watches the ball until a split second before it hits his glove. How anyone could say he was just reacting needs to have an eye exam. If you are reacting to protect yourself your limbs go towards your body not away from it, its basic reaction instinct.

Ha! thought this was done with.

When avoiding a projectile (or punch) your defensive hand will naturally continue to follow the trajectory of the offending object as you turn your body away from it. Even so if what you allege were true, starc was say a generous 15 yards from Stokes, it took about 0.5secs from throw to Stokes’s hand so the ball was travelling 15 yards at about 60 miles/hour. Stokes would have had to mentally assess the situation, look which way the ball is going, decide on a deliberate action and then physically move his body in such a way so as to complete a one handed save behind him. All in 0.5 secs, with pads on his legs and a bat in his other hand. All while having no reflex self protection instinct.

Interesting how aussies are prepared to call Stokes a liar but are more than happy to give voges & neville the benefit of the doubt about whether they knew where their hands were when they grounded the ball , even with a longer reaction time plus the benefit of afterthought.

Heres a test for ya. See how quick you can move one finger a couple of cm
http://getyourwebsitehere.com/jswb/rttest01.html

Lol at reaction time. You do know these are trained highly professional athletes at the top level yeah? They had some pretty amazing reflexes, especially when it is a reflex action that they perform 10's of thousands of times in a career. Muscle memory is an amazing thing.

Cooper wrote: Lol at reaction time. You do know these are trained highly professional athletes at the top level yeah? They had some pretty amazing reflexes, especially when it is a reflex action that they perform 10's of thousands of times in a career. Muscle memory is an amazing thing.

Glad can we agree it was a reflex action, defined in dictionary as:

the involuntary functioning or movement of any organ or body part in response to a particular stimulus. The function or action occurs immediately, without the involvement of the will or consciousness.

Only just seen a decent video of the dismissal....looks like Stokes was trying to catch the ball and decided to drop the ball when he realized his error....

Stokes dropped catch

swannsong wrote:Only just seen a decent video of the dismissal....looks like Stokes was trying to catch the ball and decided to drop the ball when he realized his error....

Stokes dropped catch

Either way, OUT handled ball then.

N5 1BH wrote:

Cooper wrote: Lol at reaction time. You do know these are trained highly professional athletes at the top level yeah? They had some pretty amazing reflexes, especially when it is a reflex action that they perform 10's of thousands of times in a career. Muscle memory is an amazing thing.

Glad can we agree it was a reflex action, defined in dictionary as:

the involuntary functioning or movement of any organ or body part in response to a particular stimulus. The function or action occurs immediately, without the involvement of the will or consciousness.

We sure do agree it was a reflex action. With him being a pro athlete trained and conditioned into catching a ball. No consciousness or will needed when your muscle memory etc works automatically as your body reacts.

Cooper wrote:

N5 1BH wrote:

Cooper wrote: Lol at reaction time. You do know these are trained highly professional athletes at the top level yeah? They had some pretty amazing reflexes, especially when it is a reflex action that they perform 10's of thousands of times in a career. Muscle memory is an amazing thing.

Glad can we agree it was a reflex action, defined in dictionary as:

the involuntary functioning or movement of any organ or body part in response to a particular stimulus. The function or action occurs immediately, without the involvement of the will or consciousness.

We sure do agree it was a reflex action. With him being a pro athlete trained and conditioned into catching a ball. No consciousness or will needed when your muscle memory etc works automatically as your body reacts.

No will needed, so you must agree it's not out then.

Bomber wrote:

swannsong wrote:Only just seen a decent video of the dismissal....looks like Stokes was trying to catch the ball and decided to drop the ball when he realized his error....

Stokes dropped catch

Either way, OUT handled ball then.

Pretty sure that handled ball has to be in the process of a shot. So, you must agree it was not out then.

God is an Englishman wrote:

Bomber wrote:

swannsong wrote:Only just seen a decent video of the dismissal....looks like Stokes was trying to catch the ball and decided to drop the ball when he realized his error....

Stokes dropped catch

Either way, OUT handled ball then.

Pretty sure that handled ball has to be in the process of a shot. So, you must agree it was not out then.

No. Remember Hilditch (late 70's?) - he picked up the ball after a return throw from the field - Pakistani bowler appealed - given out (unless the rule has since changed).
So, unless the rule change, you must agree OUT!

Law must have changed "in the act of playing at a ball delivered by the bowler"

God is an Englishman wrote:Law must have changed "in the act of playing at a ball delivered by the bowler"

Fair call, wonder what year it changed? Maybe a lot of hoo-ha after that dismissal that caused a re-think - a bit like the underarm!

The underarm was pretty low.

My White Devil wrote:The underarm was pretty low.

It was within the laws of the game at the time. Clever thinking by Greg, some would say.

Bomber wrote:

My White Devil wrote:The underarm was pretty low.

It was within the laws of the game at the time. Clever thinking by Greg, some would say.

couldnt get much lower.

Who was the keeper?

His reaction was my favourite part of it

It was Rodney Marsh and he was dead set against it.

Inappropriate Name wrote:It was Rodney Marsh and he was dead set against it.

Doesn't face up for the ball and just walks off in disgust

God is an Englishman wrote:

Inappropriate Name wrote:It was Rodney Marsh and he was dead set against it.

Doesn't face up for the ball and just walks off in disgust

To me what made it worse at the time was they needed a 6 to tie the game, their no.11 was facing and if I recall a 6 wasn't hit all match.