2014 U19 Asian Championship

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

Post by Stuckey »

Googes wrote:Would of thought he would be picked in the squad. Highly rated kid, is he pushing for first team squad?
I'm not sure. Obviously its impressive that he's with Villarreal but I'm not sure if he's playing or not, and if he still wants to play for Australia.

Edit: I'm not sure how reliable this is but according to this he hasn't played since March.

http://www.ozfootball.net/ark/Abroad/index.shtml

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

Post by Flinders SC »

Googes wrote:Would of thought he would be picked in the squad. Highly rated kid, is he pushing for first team squad?
Not really but still unlucky to miss put given where he's playing compared to the other kids in the squad. Probably needs to start looking for first team football in the near future. A few A-League clubs were interested in him this offseason.
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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

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Andy1991 wrote:
Googes wrote:Would of thought he would be picked in the squad. Highly rated kid, is he pushing for first team squad?
Not really but still unlucky to miss put given where he's playing compared to the other kids in the squad. Probably needs to start looking for first team football in the near future. A few A-League clubs were interested in him this offseason.
Surely AU were one of them?!

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

Post by Stuckey »

The young Socceroo's game are apparently going to be show live on Fox. :D
Game is on tomorrow night.

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

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Googes wrote:Would of thought he would be picked in the squad. Highly rated kid, is he pushing for first team squad?
Next you'll be whingeing that Herd isn't playing for the Socceroos this week :P
Time for some righteous indignation

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

Post by Googes »

Stitch This wrote:
Googes wrote:Would of thought he would be picked in the squad. Highly rated kid, is he pushing for first team squad?
Next you'll be whingeing that Herd isn't playing for the Socceroos this week :P
Who the f is Herd

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

Post by eagleboy »

Although they beat Indonesia, the style of play is pathetic. Is Okon the right choice for coach? The side went defensive with more than 15 minutes to go. I saw only poor structure.

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

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Have some quality players, but definitely dont think Okon is the right person for this job.

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

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eagleboy wrote:Although they beat Indonesia, the style of play is pathetic. Is Okon the right choice for coach? The side went defensive with more than 15 minutes to go. I saw only poor structure.
Apparently Awer hit the post as well.

Now we are on 4 pts with the Uzzies who we play next. A win and we're obviously thru a draw and UAE only draw and we'll be thru as well.

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

Post by COYR98 »

Looked very average so far for the quality players at his disposal. Uzbekistan are a good team so they'll need to be on top form to win and get through

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

Post by Black_Panther »

Burgess was probably the only player on display who looks Socceroos material.
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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

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So a draw against the Uzzies and UAE win means we're out on goal difference. Which means the we miss out on the U20 WC. Very dissapointing. But it was a tough group and we didn't lose a game.

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

Post by Black_Panther »

Excuses, excuses.

We still have that plan right?

Is this what the national curriculum is producing?
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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

Post by General Tony Cash »

This comment from the "Locker Room"...

It's time we accept the fact our current system of youth development is broken. The quicker we can accept this fact the quicker it would be to start to fix it. Commentators here like to call old soccer as the dark old days but one thing our U17's & U20 always did was to qualifiy in the World Cups. The socceroos losing to Qatar 1-0 just paints the story of how bad our soccer is today. There are no short term solutions. The FFA are to busy appointing spin doctors to tell us how great football is right now! Tell us how we will qualify for the next World Cup! That's all I want.

Agree, disagree? Comments?

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

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General Tony Cash wrote:This comment from the "Locker Room"...

It's time we accept the fact our current system of youth development is broken. The quicker we can accept this fact the quicker it would be to start to fix it. Commentators here like to call old soccer as the dark old days but one thing our U17's & U20 always did was to qualifiy in the World Cups. The socceroos losing to Qatar 1-0 just paints the story of how bad our soccer is today. There are no short term solutions. The FFA are to busy appointing spin doctors to tell us how great football is right now! Tell us how we will qualify for the next World Cup! That's all I want.

Agree, disagree? Comments?
The ball was dropped when the World Cup was used as "experience" for the newcomers. Its a World Cup ffs and you play best team and we, or rather Ange, didn't do that. It was alwasy going to be a risk, but we had numerous commentators going on about how well we performed. I dont care how well we performed, we lost all 3 games!
That said, if we can win the Asian Cup (anything less on home soil aint good enough for me), then maybe we can find SOME excuses for it, but we look a long way from looking like favourites here.
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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

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Bomber wrote:
General Tony Cash wrote:This comment from the "Locker Room"...

It's time we accept the fact our current system of youth development is broken. The quicker we can accept this fact the quicker it would be to start to fix it. Commentators here like to call old soccer as the dark old days but one thing our U17's & U20 always did was to qualifiy in the World Cups. The socceroos losing to Qatar 1-0 just paints the story of how bad our soccer is today. There are no short term solutions. The FFA are to busy appointing spin doctors to tell us how great football is right now! Tell us how we will qualify for the next World Cup! That's all I want.

Agree, disagree? Comments?
The ball was dropped when the World Cup was used as "experience" for the newcomers. Its a World Cup ffs and you play best team and we, or rather Ange, didn't do that. It was alwasy going to be a risk, but we had numerous commentators going on about how well we performed. I dont care how well we performed, we lost all 3 games!
That said, if we can win the Asian Cup (anything less on home soil aint good enough for me), then maybe we can find SOME excuses for it, but we look a long way from looking like favourites here.
How does anything you said there help future development?
I find it very frustrating listening to people bagging out the Socceroos yet few actually come up with an alternative.
I'm not pointing the finger at you Bomber.
The presenters of Fox are IMO the ringleaders.
Everyone on there is doom and gloom but I'm yet to hear anyone on there come up with a great alternative for the future.

Truth is when the NSL died many of Australian football's elite developement pathways died as well. The HAL is slowly repairing those pathways but it has firstly taken them a very low time to start those pathways and in most cases are far from finished. CCM probably being the only club who is in a good position. Hence why we've seen so many CCM players called up of late.

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

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Stuckey wrote:
Bomber wrote:
General Tony Cash wrote:This comment from the "Locker Room"...

It's time we accept the fact our current system of youth development is broken. The quicker we can accept this fact the quicker it would be to start to fix it. Commentators here like to call old soccer as the dark old days but one thing our U17's & U20 always did was to qualifiy in the World Cups. The socceroos losing to Qatar 1-0 just paints the story of how bad our soccer is today. There are no short term solutions. The FFA are to busy appointing spin doctors to tell us how great football is right now! Tell us how we will qualify for the next World Cup! That's all I want.

Agree, disagree? Comments?
The ball was dropped when the World Cup was used as "experience" for the newcomers. Its a World Cup ffs and you play best team and we, or rather Ange, didn't do that. It was alwasy going to be a risk, but we had numerous commentators going on about how well we performed. I dont care how well we performed, we lost all 3 games!
That said, if we can win the Asian Cup (anything less on home soil aint good enough for me), then maybe we can find SOME excuses for it, but we look a long way from looking like favourites here.
How does anything you said there help future development?
I find it very frustrating listening to people bagging out the Socceroos yet few actually come up with an alternative.
I'm not pointing the finger at you Bomber.
The presenters of Fox are IMO the ringleaders.
Everyone on there is doom and gloom but I'm yet to hear anyone on there come up with a great alternative for the future.

Truth is when the NSL died many of Australian football's elite developement pathways died as well. The HAL is slowly repairing those pathways but it has firstly taken them a very low time to start those pathways and in most cases are far from finished. CCM probably being the only club who is in a good position. Hence why we've seen so many CCM players called up of late.
More excuses. People like you are the problem with where we are headed.

You make it acceptable to lose. All the wank talk about development pathways and Kelly Cross hide the fact that we have taken away our biggest asset as a country - our competitive instinct. Also add to that we aren't producing the technical players that we used to means that we are also rans against countries that we should be smashing off the park.

SBS has a big share of this blame as well, giving that knob foster a soap box has given his Barossa Pearl a platform.
"I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. That's why I succeed." -Michael Jordan

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

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Black_Panther wrote:
More excuses. People like you are the problem with where we are headed.

You make it acceptable to lose. All the wank talk about development pathways and Kelly Cross hide the fact that we have taken away our biggest asset as a country - our competitive instinct. Also add to that we aren't producing the technical players that we used to means that we are also rans against countries that we should be smashing off the park.

SBS has a big share of this blame as well, giving that knob foster a soap box has given his Barossa Pearl a platform.
Ok well what needs to change? IMO people like you are the problem. Its obviously easy to sit there and point at a result and say that's not good enough. But thats all I seem to hear. Like the Fox people saying we need to focus on winning. Yes that sounds great but means nothing really.

If you people aren't happy with the direction we're taking then offer an alternative instead of just saying result are crap and this isn't good enough.

Like I mentioned before in France it took a decade for their football culture change to bring them serious results. But they were lucky enough to have existing clubs able to adapt to the change. Australia has had to build those clubs first.
Whether people agree with that or not its what has taken place and one of the main reasons why we are in this position IMO.

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

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You realize the only one to come through national curriculum is De Silva and he was the one who was the standout of the tournament for the Aussies. The current batch to PARTIALLY come through the national curriculum is the U17 and if you watched the AFC, they looked outstanding and qualified for the World Cup. Okon has to be blamed for this. Youth is the future for Australia's future yet they employ someone that has never had managerial experience. 2 failures now, this one bigger than the last, and he has to do better.

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

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COYR98 wrote:You realize the only one to come through national curriculum is De Silva and he was the one who was the standout of the tournament for the Aussies. The current batch to PARTIALLY come through the national curriculum is the U17 and if you watched the AFC, they looked outstanding and qualified for the World Cup. Okon has to be blamed for this. Youth is the future for Australia's future yet they employ someone that has never had managerial experience. 2 failures now, this one bigger than the last, and he has to do better.
So the national curriculum isn't even capable of producing players for the national team???
"I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. That's why I succeed." -Michael Jordan

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

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Black_Panther wrote:
COYR98 wrote:You realize the only one to come through national curriculum is De Silva and he was the one who was the standout of the tournament for the Aussies. The current batch to PARTIALLY come through the national curriculum is the U17 and if you watched the AFC, they looked outstanding and qualified for the World Cup. Okon has to be blamed for this. Youth is the future for Australia's future yet they employ someone that has never had managerial experience. 2 failures now, this one bigger than the last, and he has to do better.
So the national curriculum isn't even capable of producing players for the national team???
The kids that played in this u20 qualifying campaign were not brought up during the vital ages of 9-13yo with the national curriculum
Who knows what type of cowboy training they received during these most important years of player development

The current batch of Joeys are the ones who were partially introduced to the NC during these important ages

The current u20, u23 and senior Socceroos had nothing to do with the National Curriculum in their junior development

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

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COYR98 wrote: Youth is the future for Australia's future.
Image

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

Post by Black_Panther »

Socca wrote:
Black_Panther wrote:
COYR98 wrote:You realize the only one to come through national curriculum is De Silva and he was the one who was the standout of the tournament for the Aussies. The current batch to PARTIALLY come through the national curriculum is the U17 and if you watched the AFC, they looked outstanding and qualified for the World Cup. Okon has to be blamed for this. Youth is the future for Australia's future yet they employ someone that has never had managerial experience. 2 failures now, this one bigger than the last, and he has to do better.
So the national curriculum isn't even capable of producing players for the national team???
The kids that played in this u20 qualifying campaign were not brought up during the vital ages of 9-13yo with the national curriculum
Who knows what type of cowboy training they received during these most important years of player development

The current batch of Joeys are the ones who were partially introduced to the NC during these important ages

The current u20, u23 and senior Socceroos had nothing to do with the National Curriculum in their junior development
So the cowboy coaching as you put it that produced the golden generation of socceroos (kewell, viduka, moore, cahill et al) was responsible for performance of the current players rather than the culture of performance (or lack thereof)/aesthetics over results?
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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

Post by Socca »

So you're saying that the same coaches that helped develop the 'golden generation', who were mostly first generation migrants with previous football/coaching experience from overseas, were/are still coaching this generation of u20, u23 and senior Socceroos ?

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

Post by Bomber »

Stuckey wrote:
Bomber wrote:
General Tony Cash wrote:This comment from the "Locker Room"...

It's time we accept the fact our current system of youth development is broken. The quicker we can accept this fact the quicker it would be to start to fix it. Commentators here like to call old soccer as the dark old days but one thing our U17's & U20 always did was to qualifiy in the World Cups. The socceroos losing to Qatar 1-0 just paints the story of how bad our soccer is today. There are no short term solutions. The FFA are to busy appointing spin doctors to tell us how great football is right now! Tell us how we will qualify for the next World Cup! That's all I want.

Agree, disagree? Comments?
The ball was dropped when the World Cup was used as "experience" for the newcomers. Its a World Cup ffs and you play best team and we, or rather Ange, didn't do that. It was alwasy going to be a risk, but we had numerous commentators going on about how well we performed. I dont care how well we performed, we lost all 3 games!
That said, if we can win the Asian Cup (anything less on home soil aint good enough for me), then maybe we can find SOME excuses for it, but we look a long way from looking like favourites here.
How does anything you said there help future development?
I find it very frustrating listening to people bagging out the Socceroos yet few actually come up with an alternative.
I'm not pointing the finger at you Bomber.
The presenters of Fox are IMO the ringleaders.
Everyone on there is doom and gloom but I'm yet to hear anyone on there come up with a great alternative for the future.

Truth is when the NSL died many of Australian football's elite developement pathways died as well. The HAL is slowly repairing those pathways but it has firstly taken them a very low time to start those pathways and in most cases are far from finished. CCM probably being the only club who is in a good position. Hence why we've seen so many CCM players called up of late.
Apologies for late response, had forgot this forum exists sometimes.
My point isnt about future development, its about timing.
Holger was appointed to get the team into the finals - he did, and yes, there were some "oldies" still in the squad then.
Suddenly it was thought to be a good idea to oust Holger and get Ange in BEFORE the WC finals to get a decent "style" happening.
Then, amazingly a handful of experienced players "conveniently" retired from international football and we lost all 3 games.
Thing is, I would have had no problem with Ange being appointed AFTER the WC and given time to develop what was always going to be a more youthful squad. This also on assumption Holger had poor tournament results.
You cant get higher than the World Cup - this is not the tounament where you experiment.
You wear a socceroo shirt, you hardly need development, well you shouldnt really. You should already be up to it!
Like I said, I will give the hierarchy the benefit of the doubt for now, but I stand by the fact that anything less than winning the Asian Cup (at home), really wont be good enough.
And like it or not, as we slide down the FIFA rankings, the harder our "pots/groups" will become.
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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

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Bomber wrote:
Stuckey wrote:
Bomber wrote:
The ball was dropped when the World Cup was used as "experience" for the newcomers. Its a World Cup ffs and you play best team and we, or rather Ange, didn't do that. It was alwasy going to be a risk, but we had numerous commentators going on about how well we performed. I dont care how well we performed, we lost all 3 games!
That said, if we can win the Asian Cup (anything less on home soil aint good enough for me), then maybe we can find SOME excuses for it, but we look a long way from looking like favourites here.
How does anything you said there help future development?
I find it very frustrating listening to people bagging out the Socceroos yet few actually come up with an alternative.
I'm not pointing the finger at you Bomber.
The presenters of Fox are IMO the ringleaders.
Everyone on there is doom and gloom but I'm yet to hear anyone on there come up with a great alternative for the future.

Truth is when the NSL died many of Australian football's elite developement pathways died as well. The HAL is slowly repairing those pathways but it has firstly taken them a very low time to start those pathways and in most cases are far from finished. CCM probably being the only club who is in a good position. Hence why we've seen so many CCM players called up of late.
Apologies for late response, had forgot this forum exists sometimes.
My point isnt about future development, its about timing.
Holger was appointed to get the team into the finals - he did, and yes, there were some "oldies" still in the squad then.
Suddenly it was thought to be a good idea to oust Holger and get Ange in BEFORE the WC finals to get a decent "style" happening.
Then, amazingly a handful of experienced players "conveniently" retired from international football and we lost all 3 games.
Thing is, I would have had no problem with Ange being appointed AFTER the WC and given time to develop what was always going to be a more youthful squad. This also on assumption Holger had poor tournament results.
You cant get higher than the World Cup - this is not the tounament where you experiment.
You wear a socceroo shirt, you hardly need development, well you shouldnt really. You should already be up to it!
Like I said, I will give the hierarchy the benefit of the doubt for now, but I stand by the fact that anything less than winning the Asian Cup (at home), really wont be good enough.
And like it or not, as we slide down the FIFA rankings, the harder our "pots/groups" will become.
Which players would have you cut and brought in?
Forgetting the Spain game when we were out anyway, do you really think those replacements who have helped us play that much better against the quality of Chile and The Netherlands?

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

Post by Bomber »

The team that got us through, by and large, was ample for me. Scwhwarzer for one, I believe would not have retired has Holger was still in charge.
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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

Post by Black_Panther »

Bomber wrote:The team that got us through, by and large, was ample for me. Scwhwarzer for one, I believe would not have retired has Holger was still in charge.
I know he is unpopular, but I believe that Neill would have done a much better job of marshalling the defence than Spiranovic & that Wilkshire would have done a much better job than Franjic/McGowan at right back.
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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

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Bomber wrote:The team that got us through, by and large, was ample for me. Scwhwarzer for one, I believe would not have retired has Holger was still in charge.
How? We barely got thru the qualification stage where all but Japan were worse than us. Suddenly that's going to turn around against 3 of the top 15 nations?
If we actually did a decent job of qualifying then we would have been in Japan's far more open group.

Just look at the EAFF qualifications. Holger started with the oldies who struggled against Hong Kong. So Holger was forced into playing the younger players who then pumped Guam 9-0.
Holger then reverted back to the oldies for the North Korea game they only drew that. Then it was up to the youth again the get all the goals the oldies couldn't get against Hong Kong for us to qualify.

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Re: 2014 U19 Asian Championship

Post by Bomber »

Stuckey wrote:
Bomber wrote:The team that got us through, by and large, was ample for me. Scwhwarzer for one, I believe would not have retired has Holger was still in charge.
How? We barely got thru the qualification stage where all but Japan were worse than us. Suddenly that's going to turn around against 3 of the top 15 nations?
If we actually did a decent job of qualifying then we would have been in Japan's far more open group.

Just look at the EAFF qualifications. Holger started with the oldies who struggled against Hong Kong. So Holger was forced into playing the younger players who then pumped Guam 9-0.
Holger then reverted back to the oldies for the North Korea game they only drew that. Then it was up to the youth again the get all the goals the oldies couldn't get against Hong Kong for us to qualify.
Ok, answer me this then - is a World Cup, the pinnacle of football, a tournament that you should experiment in?
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